Prophetic Word for & about Gloria Copeland, Kenneth Copeland Ministries (KCM)
I have prayed about this as well as ’sat’ on it for a few days and am convinced this is for public view. I have already notified KCM ministries in Fort Worth of this prophecy’s existence and given them a link to it. They unhelpfully would not supply me with better contact details. (They did not know its content). I have not altered or deleted one single word in order to stay faithful to God. I fear God more than Man. It is the truth and He will vindicate me.
Please note that the main revelation is in purple font and this should be viewed as the actual ‘pure’ revelation and prophecy. I have anotated it and added notes and my own opinions in brown front – and as my opinions and understanding may not be quite correct as they are not ‘pure’ revelation, I have differentiated it from the purple words.
A few nights ago, I heard God speak the name ‘Gloria Copeland’ and I then saw a vision of her. (I had not seen Gloria before this but I knew exactly what she looked like as has been subsequentally confirmed by an internet search. I was very surprised to hear God speak her name to me: it came out of ‘nowhere’ as I have not heard her name or thought about her for a long time.) Then, in the vision, I saw that Gloria Copeland was naked, but for being dressed in a black garbage bag which acted as a makeshift dress for her. I wondered what this meant, and then God reminded me that what one ‘dresses’ in can be in a spiritual sense – spiritual clothes comprising a spiritual covering which is either of the darkness or of the light, and indicating one’s righteousness (or not) before God.
‘You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realise that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked, I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.’ (Revelation 3:17)
I realised that God was saying that Gloria Copeland was spiritually dressed in ‘garbage’ before Him. The garbage bag was black, representing she was of darkness and not the light. She is currently not viewed as righteous before God and is not of the light. Furthermore she is leading many Christians astray by her ‘dark’ false teaching and false prophecies. God pulled no punches at getting straight to the point about her. Christians should have nothing to do with her (unless she publically repents).
(An ‘apologetic’: I did not know anything about Gloria Copeland before this vision apart from I knew her name and the fact she was a Pentecostal on Christian TV now and again. I certainly did not think her to be all that ‘bad’ doctrinally, or otherwise, (but then I did not really know anything about her as I had never researched her). I wish to emphasise there was no prejudice toward her on my part before this vision. I was surprised to hear 1) God speak her name and 2) to hear such a strongly worded detailed prophecy about her. However, I know God’s voice and know this is Him and that he is speaking the truth.
He has every right to use such strong words and to publically shame her as I have since researched and discovered there is plenty of evidence to confirm why God is angry with Gloria. This prophecy is entirely agrees with documented evidence about her and her husband Kenneth’s ministry and beliefs. God if anything, is being very kind about her/them in this prophecy, bearing in mind all they have done: He is giving them a chance to repent. This is not a prophecy of hate, it is one of love, it is sent in order to rescue and release and ultimately bless and build up and to save and not to condemn or mock. Yes the words are strong, but God has every right to cut right to the hearts: they are His words and not my own, I have not altered them in any way – all my anotations are deliberately kept in another font colour to keep the prophecy ‘pure’. He has used harsher words in the past against idolators, fools and mockers who despise the Lord their God. It is up to the Copelands whether they respond to God in a spirit of repentance and humility or if they continue on their ‘collision’ course. God loves them and is urging them to come to Him, but he has made it clear that he will not suffer their foolishness much longer if they delay repenting.
This prophecy is also for the wider church in order to identify the Copeland’s errors, to other ministries to recognise God will judge ministries like the Copelands either here or in the world to come, and to warn them to make sure they are right before God, and this prophecy is also to Copeland’s followers to warn them to steer clear of them….and if you continue to support them in any shape or form, you are supporting something that God has made abundantly clear he hates and you will be rebelling against God and risking his wrath.)
The next night (after the first vision of her dressed in the garbage bag), I asked for more information, confirmation and clarity about the Gloria vision. I saw a vision of Gloria Copeland taking a little brown dog for a walk down the street. She looks very finely dressed, her hair is all done pristinely and she is wearing an expensive looking ‘power suit’. The little dog she is walking suddenly runs ahead of her and so she lets slip of its leash by accident and the dog runs off. She runs after it, but she cannot keep up with it and catch it. She runs tottering on her high heels after it, her heavy pearl necklace flapping against her neck as she runs. It is a comical sight. The dog runs far ahead barking.
‘She cannot keep up with it, or control this dog. How far less can she control me, the Lord of hosts?’ asks the Lord. ‘She makes her demands, pointing with a boney finger and jabbing at her shopping list saying ‘I’ll have this, I’ll have that’, (I see her with dark eyes which are greedy and self serving and a cold heart while she does this ‘prayer’) with little regard for what I want. So, says the Lord of Hosts, I will allow trouble (in judgment – I thought it may be sickness but not sure what exactly it was) to come upon her, and all her pearls of wisdom (her false theology) and other fine things (she is very greedy and materialistic) will not save her in that day. Then perhaps she will come before me on her knees, in humility.’ (to ask for release from judgment/problems)
I then see her emptying sand out from one of her high heel shoes, so God says there is much error in her walk and the ‘gospel’ that she presents. ‘
She makes things look fine on the outside as she ensures enough lipgloss is on her lips, and flicks/preens her hair for the tv cameras and her public as she titivates herself (making herself look good on the outside), forgetting that I, the Lord of Hosts, see all and know the heart, and her heart is not right before me, neither does she want to know me.’ She plots in secret with her husband, her sight on business growth charts and goals and money – there her heart truly is – and she has forgotten me, the Lord her God.
She claims to give out medicine yet she feeds out poison, that makes people sick to their stomachs and with forked tongues they vomit it out. (The forked tongues are like a snake’s tongue indicating what she feeds (her doctine) is dark/satanic in origin).
‘(Gloria), You see yourself like a shining star in the sky, (I see her and Kenneth’s ministry photo glued onto a large star (which was a bit like a photo stuck onto a star shaped rosette) on a large poster with other stars (stars = angels/spiritual beings/gods) stuck onto a blue sky (sky = the heavens/celestial realms) and she and Kenneth place their own star which was their photo high up at the top of this poster on the left hand side - symbolically representing how they elevate themselves) you elevate yourself, but I will make you a shooting star that vanishes and is remembered no more. ‘We are as gods’ you say, ‘gods of the most high’. Tell me do you know the ways of heaven? You do not even know the ways of earth! I tell you the truth that a bird collecting twigs for its nest shows more wisdom and foresight that you do. There is more wisdom in its collecting and building for it knows what its home is to be like/where it is. You do not. You cling to the things of this world but they are but rubbish.
‘Who is like unto us?’ you say proudly. (pp who is like unto the beast)
He will command his angels concerning you that you WILL strike your foot against a stone (judgment is coming pp Herod’s being eaten by worms in Acts as the people said he was a god and he did not rebuke them so was struck by an angel with sickness)
How you will fall Oh son of the Dawn (son of the dawn = satan – this is indicating the true power behind Gloria Copeland)
How the people will mourn
You (Gloria) are (part of) the false prophet that will be cast into the fiery pit (If you do not repent)
‘Did I know?’ she (Gloria) asks (and others ask for her – that is, can she be excused from such judgment as did she not really know that it was dark in origin?)
Yes you did (know)! (says God). You knew the source and yet you repented not and led multitudes astray with you. Like the pied piper you led them into brimming supermarket aisles (advocating greed and materialism as well as also selling the gospel/prophecies for your own ends) and you and they rejoiced to the chime of cash registers.
Ding dong merrily on high
The cash registers are ringing
Ding dong merrily on high
The Copelands are sinning
La la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la Gloria
In Excelsis, (in excelsis = ‘in the highest’ – meaning glory to Gloria Copeland who claims to be a god) Did they ‘buy’ it? (‘Buy’ as in merchandising the ‘gospel’, but also did they ‘buy’ it, were the people fooled?)
I then see a vision of a clock with dark hands stuck at six o’clock – six is the number of man – ‘So you are not gods but men. Are you equal to me? (If so) Then stop this judgment coming on you ‘Gloria’.’ says God.
I see Gloria relaxing in a swimming pool floating on their back in quite a decadent way, and then she is pressed down upon from above by a dark hand (Satan) with the intent to drown her. It is a spiritual anointing albeit dark in origin. (The Greek for the Spirit of the Lord being upon someone conveys the idea of the ‘anointing’ pressing down on the person) and this counterfeit anointing is pressing down upon her neck for hateful reasons. The pressing down is at the Adam’s apple area (I know she is a lady and does not have one but this is symbolic) - and the Adam’s apple is representing biting into the apple, sinfulness, the serpent, occult wisdom etc. God is saying Satan has her by the neck with the view to drowning her –Gloria does not realise the danger she is in or how much her ‘allie’ hates her, she has been conned – and there is a false anointing as well as sinfulness and rebellion in her life.
God says that she is a rebellious child that does not want to know. God has given her chances to repent, He has waited patiently but he will wait no more, and she will be no more.
Judgment is coming upon your house (plural) so possibly more than Gloria will be judged when it strikes.
God shows me Gloria – in a vision she is as a mare (female horse) (but ‘mare’ is also the word for a problematic person – a ‘nightmare’ – hence God uses this term too) and it is stomping its feet and tossing its head, and sets itself up in opposition to God. (She is rebellious intentionally, she knows better, she is a mare to deal with and correct).
I then see her with others playing with black chess pieces (= the dark side) including a chess piece that becomes a bigger chess piece and it resembles an oriental eastern wise man idol with a long moustache down past his waist (karate kid style) (representing eastern religion/occultic mysticism) and it is red (pp the red dragon in revelation = satan) ‘Why do you divine in secret? You have a secret tea party (like Alice in wonderland) and drink strange foreign things – come to MY table for I will quench your thirst and fill your hunger.’
I then see Gloria on a ladder trying to clean the upper windows of her house which are filthy (upper windows = her mind) and these windows are polluted with strange bonfire smoke, from strange fires (false religion/false revival/false anointing/idolotary). Come clean these windows, you cannot clean the stain yourself, it is so filthy (even her rags are filthy), only God can clean these stains. (Let God do it and repent of this filth.)
‘I put you in stocks and publically shame you for all you have done, and I humiliate you.’ (Perhaps the meaning of this is that He is shaming her by this public word, and perhaps God will send other things to humiliate her. She is such a public figure that she must be publically rebuked and named and shamed – she has led masses astray. It is no slight thing.)
‘Do not raise your finger against me, do not dare!’ (says God). ‘How is that Satan has so enamoured your heart that you believe you can take my place?! Can any? Can he? If he cannot himself, how will he give you the power to? Yet he has seduced you, the beautiful serpent has beguiled you and twisted your mind to believe you can sieze my throne. Anarchy!’
I see in a vision Gloria planting a garden but she plants it with floppy dead and unhealthy weeds. No good word dwells in you, your cakes do not rise, your buildings are left less than half built (this is all spiritual not physical), your shoes run ahead with no feet in them. There is a lack of power, lack of truth, lack of righteousness, lack of peace, lack of me (God).
‘He who trusts in me, out of him will come rivers of living water’
I see her stomach (and also, I think, the stomachs of those she ministers to), and the vision is in direct contrast to the above scriptural promise, and something horrible is punching the stomach from the outside so she is crippled over in agony (though they do not know it), and I see her mouth open and out of it comes literally empty hollow words. There is no noise. (God is saying that it is not true rivers and not true words from her ministry, and it damages and hursts rather than blesses and builds up and empowers.)
I see a set square – (the freemasonry symbol) – God says, ‘So I have measured you and found you lacking.’
I see her encouraging people to board a false train (false gospel), yet God says he wants her to get back onto the true train.
‘Though he slay me, yet I will hope in him’ Job 13:15
I see her hands and they are diviners hands and magicians fingertips, they are dangling and sparkling and hungry for the (counterfeit) anointing – itchy fingers and itchy hands. You attempt to sell my anointing to the highest bidder – and who has bought your soul? Whom have you offered it to (for money) Hmm? Who? You and I know full well, you wicked doer! ‘
You pretend all is sweet, yet you allow your husband to share another woman’s bed and this has gone on for years. His infidility has gone on in your full view/knowledge, yet you give it your ‘blessing’. Well, just as he has slept around on you, so you have slept around on me!’ says the Lord.
‘Shall I measure them?’ (them = Copelands) a voice from heaven says. ‘Are they 9 inches high, as surely they are in my hand!’ says the Lord. (Kenneth is reported as saying God the Father is about 6 foot 2 and has a 9 inch hand span. God, of course, is omnipresent. Heaven is his throne, and Earth is his footstall.) ‘and my anger burns against them. As reeds burnt in a forest fire, so will I destroy them. They have provoked me to anger. The people think I am dead and no longer judge, and that I no longer care, and my name is profaned, they are blasphemers, Kenneth cuts me down in vile tongues and mocks me openly. His lips are sensuous and polluted and tingling and sinful. ‘
See this burning coal has touched your lips’ (Isaiah) I urge you to let God’s ‘burning coal’ – his atoning and cleansing touch touch your ministry and so transform it from a work of darkness to one of the light, so that with skilful shepherds crooks, Gloria and Kenneth will shepherd the flock (become true shepherds for God.) ‘
Be for me or be against me, choose which way’ says God. (Last chance, repent today while there is still time for you.).
Even now, declares the LORD, return to me with all your heart, with fasting and weeping and mourning. Rend your heart and not your garments. Return to the LORD your God, for he is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger and abounding in love, and he relents from sending calamity. Joel 2:12-13
By your many sins and dishonest trade you have desecrated your sanctuaries. So I made a fire come out from you, and it consumed you, and I reduced you to ashes on the ground in the sight of all who were watching. All the nations who knew you are appalled at you; you have come to a horrible end and will be no more.‘ Ezekiel 28:18-19
Excuse me, but you are either a joke or living in deception. Personally, I feel you are joke.
I ask you if, hypothetically, a false shepherd DID teach another gospel, blasphemed against God by calling themself a god, if they exalted themselves and were proudly living in open rebellion against God, if they were fleecing the flock for their greed, if they were using divination and counterfeit anointings and knew the true source was not of God but the devil, if they led multitudes astray with their another gospel: do you not think that the one true God would be angry about it? Furious even? The God revealed in the Bible most certainly would!
And do you not think this one true God who was angry could speak to a prophet of his about it if He so desired to not only call the false shepherd to repent, warning of judgment if they did not, but also to warn the flock that were decieved by this false minister? The God revealed in the Bible most certainly would and most certainly does!
So what exactly is your point here?
The issue is not whether you think I am a ‘joke’ or not – it is whether the words I speak are true and from God or not. I ask you to ask God about them if you know the Lord and get his take on things rather than assume that just because the Copelands appear on TBN etc and have a ministry that they are godly Christian folk.
Now if you can show me where I am either decieved or in error, then I welcome your input, if you use scriptural principles or a valid reason rather than just name calling. There is enough documented evidence that the Copelands are far from a true Christian ministry.
Wake up! Shepherds are out there who lead their flock to hell.
I bind the hands of darkness and the anti-christ who sent those perverted lies across the website. The kingdom of satan will fall and there is no hope or those who fall with it.
Beckie: you cannot bind the truth. Please research what is ‘darkness’ and what is ‘antichrist’ and what is not, before you attempt to ‘bind’ anything!
By all means, if you show me specifically where something I have said is ‘perverted’ or is ‘lies’, I will be rebuked and will publically apologise. I say this for your benefit as I know my God and I know His voice and know it is the truth I speak. Do you know God and His voice or do you just go around ‘binding’ and ‘loosing’ things?
Also do you know what the Copelands actually really teach and believe before you accuse those who speak the truth of them of being liars? And finally are you aware that you dare to call the Holy Spirit a liar? He is the one who showed me these things.
I would also like to remind the Copeland ministry, thinking of any other responses to this prophecy, of the story of Aninias and Saphira. They dared to ‘test’ the Holy Spirit by lying. Look what happened to them. Fear God. Live in truth, don’t think you can continue to mock God and get away with it. And don’t even dare trying to cover up when God reveals you for what you are and dare to lie to or test the Holy Spirit.
I am not saying you are lying or telling the truth, I will trust God to reveal what the truth is, but I really need to get some clarity here. Are you saying that the Copelands 1. profess to be gods 2. knowingly serve satan and 3. are intentionally trying to deceive the people of God? I am not a follower of the Copelands, but when it comes to something this deep, It’s worth questioning. Can you provide me with proof that they said they or Gods? I do not watch so I would not know. I have watched periodotically in the past, but i was never a follower.
>Can you provide me with proof that they said they are Gods
There are numerous watchman discernment sites that you can google on the Copeland’s ministry which will give you a wealth of information about exactly some of the things the Copelands say and believe. Kenneth boasts (speaking about God saying ‘I am’ – ‘yeah I am too!’ He also claims heaven is a planet as well as some other very off things. His teachings are more mormon than Christian in origin.
My interpretation of the above prophecy about Gloria Copeland, is that God has said that their teachings and practices are not of the light, but of darkness, that Gloria is deliberately in rebellion to God, she tries to control God, she is greedy and self serving, she has no heart for the things of God, her eyes are set on mammon and she fleeces the flock for her own ends intentionally and wilfully, she feeds the flock poison which is satanic in origin and that Gloria also knows she is not serving the one true God and has no real interest to either. She is rebellious and will not listen to God, and she practices things forbidden by God with her theology and practices and anointings with an eastern mysticism and divination bent in it. She knows she is in rebellion to God and has no interest in getting back into line. God has tried to correct her and waited patiently for her but she has so far refused to come under his authority and leadership to date.
This prophetic word is right on target!!! PTL! 2 years ago I found Gloria Copeland to be completely unscriptural in her teachings which totally amazed me at the time (I stopped counting the number of times I have read the entire New Testament once I got to 35 times – 3 years ago. I have completely read the Old Testament 3 times. I dont consider myself a prophet, but extremely knowledgeable of His Word). I must say that the Copelands’ ministry left me very hurt and disappointed once I realized how truly erroneous it is. It has been 2 years since I found out that I could not stand the sight of Gloria Copeland preaching in total error. This prophet word affirms what I know to be true about Gloria Copeland, in particular. Praise God who always affirms what is True!
Marie Claire, please feel free to post what you felt was wrong with their teachings here for others who cannot be bothered to google the discernment sites.
Endtimesprophet: Thank you for the invitation, but just thinking about Gloria Copeland gives me a dark, sick feeling in my stomach and I have long since mentally blocked out the specifics of her erroneous teachings. I had totally written off the Copelands two years ago, but I came across your prophetic word and was happy to have confirmation about what Spirit told me concerning Gloria in particular. As you know, if anyone really cares to find out the Truth for himself, the Lord will oblige them. I thank God that you have the patience to take the time to blog your prophesies. I am praying for patience to deal with folks who are too lazy to read the Word, pray, and seek the Truth(God)for themselves. Continued to blessings you!
Continued blessings to you!!!
Nothing about Kenneth Copeland?
Healtheland: I speak only what God told me, nothing more and nothing less. God seems to have chosen to focus more on Gloria. There is a bit about both Kenneth and Gloria in this prophecy though, and it clearly indicates both are in the wrong on many points. It is not just Gloria that needs to get right with God.
See also about TV evangelists:
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/2007/08/26/christian-tv-and-sending-money-to-christian-ministries/
and
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/2007/08/04/vision-of-church-robbing-the-widows-mite/
Im sorry, I just happened upon your website. I feel sorry for you. I definetly think your on very shaky ground. If any of your “prophecies” were from the Lord, it doesnt make any sense you would publicly post them. These issues are private matters, God is a tender father and deals with his children in personal ways. I dont think I ever remember any of the old testament prophets ever announcing to the public when the Lord had a word for a specific person. It was always dealt with one on one in a private matter. Im scared for your judgment. You better be careful when you throw out words such as “thus sayeth the Lord”
I curse this vile wicked spirit; You spirit of Corah I cast you down in Jesus Christ Mighty Name. It is written touch not my Annoited; do my Prophets no harm in Jesus Christ Mighty Name I rebuke you and cast you down; to the pitts of hell. For I am my brothers keeper. To God be the Glory and Honour in Jesus Christ Mighty Name. The Blood of Jesus Christ is all powerful. And you will bow down to the Blood; you spirit of error.
Jesus Christ is Lord! It written every shall bow and every tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.
From one to another: I suggest you take another read of the Bible which is far from private in itself and has some deeply personal matters about people’s lives contained in it which God has made available to many millions of people over the years. God also publically rebukes when He chooses to, and often uses his prophets for doing so.
John the Baptist told Herod off for his choice of wife, Heroditas, and this was accepted public knowledge, meaning it was not just spoken between John and Herod in private. This was the reason why Heroditas wanted John’s head on a platter, not so much because he were a prophet but because he dared to speak up about her and Herod living in ’sin’.
>These issues are private matters
NOT when it comes to the church, and false teachers and leaders leading multitudes astray. It then becomes a public matter. This prophecy is not just for Gloria and Kenneth. If it were, I would not post it openly. This prophecy is more for the church than for those two vipers – can you not see this?
>If any of your “prophecies” were from the Lord, it doesnt make any sense you would publicly post them.
Why did the prophets write some of their prophecies down in the OT for others to read? So we may be instructed also and learn from it.
This prophecy is to warn the church about the Copelands, and to watch what happens to them when God’s judgment comes – for it surely will – if these two do not heed God’s word and they continue to mock God.
God’s anointed: are you going to curse and cast out the wicked lying spirits out of Kenneth and Gloria Copeland too?
I wonder why you dare to even curse spirits? Do you not know the Bible where it is shown that even the archangel Michael when in dispute about Moses’ body with Satan, did not dare blaspheme against the angels and demons but merely said ‘The Lord rebuke you’? Are you better than Michael? ‘Cast out’ but do not ‘curse’.
Be careful you do not curse God’s Holy Spirit which is exactly what you have done, anointed one.
>the Bible says “do not touch my anointed and do my prophets no harm!”
The Hebrew for ‘harm’ in this context means to physically harm or kill and destroy. It does not mean that God’s anointed ones are beyond reproach or criticism which is a differant thing entirely.
David recognised he should not physically harm or kill King Saul, God’s anointed one, but it did not mean he could not speak up about Saul and ‘rebuke’ him when he was in the wrong.
Later on, the prophet Nathan rebuked King David for his sin with the killing of Bathsheba’s husband. Many other prophets rebuked and criticised Kings and leaders in the OT. If the scripture you quoted meant it to be what you and numerous others in the 21st century church claim it means, then Nathan and these other prophets would have sinned when they opened their mouths. Of course he and they did not – they honoured God. The apostles spoke up even about the other apostles and openly rebuked them sometimes, such as in the case of Peter. That means your version of ‘touch not my anointed’ is twisted and it is perfectly godly and perfectly right to speak up when a leader or indeed any Christian is in error.
I have to say once again, take my words to God and ask Him about them first, rather than automatically assume I am wrong. If you weigh them up with an open heart and mind and you truly love the truth, and your decision agrees with scripture then I cannot ask more of you.
I just rushed through the comments but the post- wow- right on !!! I am so glad to hear God will deal with these false teachers many are on TBN and other places.
As far a documenting the Copelands saying they are little gods- I believe I read it in “The Seduction of Christianity” by Dave Hunt. A great book if you are at all concerned about dangerous new age/occult teaching in the Christian Church. I think Kenneth Copeland, and Kenneth Hagin are both mentioned. But you can still get much of the heresy the Copelands teach on the internet by looking up discernment ministries. Please, for your own spiritual well being please educate yourselves about these false teachers.
-Thanks Endtimes.Too bad so many are unwilling to test these people to the Word of God.
-Mary Biemer
I’m sorry but I gotta laugh at the comments :”from one to another” someone touched your golden calf and it huuorts!!
ouch.
no, sorry Mary, no one is “my golden calf’ God is a spirit and He only is to be worshipped in Spirit and truth. I bow down to no one except Him and even so I don’t subscribe to be a follower of anyone except Jesus Christ. It does’nt “hurt” me to say the least.
As for the “prophetess” who makes her public posting, well she’s no John the Baptist.
Very deep… very interesting… Anyone with open eyes would see that the Copelands are shysters and snake oil salesmen… common sense would tell you after listening to just 1 of good ole glorias TV shows or tapes should be enough to make you realize all the copelands crave in this life is wealth and riches… but and this is the important part… Kenneth Copeland is 70 years old… Gloria is 65 …Basically their days are almost up(as far as their Business goes).. they are now grooming their children and grandchildren to take over the family “business”..oooops i meant Ministry…..One thing of interest i did see in your prophecy was that Gloria has indeed been inflicted with a rather nasty thing called Sleep Apnea which on some cases is fatal(in your prophecy you did mention Gloria being inflicted with a bad illness)who knows maybe these people will get the just deserts they deserve.. but the worst part is right here right now they are living like kings and queens on the money of the foolish and gullible ..
God would be indeed Furious
Joh: I did not realise Kenneth and Gloria were that old…
Yes they most definitely are that old… the cosmetic surgery and makeup makes them look much younger…..in your prophecy you said the hand of satan was trying to Drown or strangle Gloria?? maybe the sleep apnea she suffers from is just that?
Who knows…..but in one of their outdoor TV broadcasts from their log cabins in the Ozarks Ken Copeland did describe how he Heard Gloria Struggling to breathe while she slept… maybe this is just the start of her punishment for her greed and lies?I didnt hear or see anything about a swimming pool in there though…Although one other story the copelands did talk about was on their way back from their visit to Australia they stopped in Hawaii for rest and whilst outside on the balcony of the motel sunning themselves their was an earthquake which shook the building.. of cause they used this of being an example of how they were blessed and protected by God etc….not a huge Earthquake more like the real reason.. infact it hardly did any damage from my recollection… whatever wherever and whenever im sure like in Karma or Gods Discipline or whatever religion you choose to follow The Copelands Will have their Day… unfortunately seeing as they are Very well aged we most likely will never get to see it or hear about it… but for the many people the Copelands have conned out of their savings and hurt .. i wish we could see it….Remember “an eye for an eye”
Joh:
There could be another interpretation beyond what I saw and it could be referring to sleep apnea (which I had no knowledge of) as well as the interpretation I actually said, I do not know and cannot discount that totally. I think the main point I got though was already expressed: the fact that Satan hates Gloria Copeland, Gloria is blissfully unaware of the current danger she is in or the extent of Satan’s treachory toward her or the fact there is a false anointing pushing down on her for ill purposes and not for good. I did not think the vision meant Satan would literally drown her in a swimming pool (and in fact think this unlikely) – the pool meant to me more about being blissfully unaware and relaxing in wealth and comfort and decadence – but the vision was referring to a spiritual and metaphorical drowning/choking. It does not mean that it definitely will not happen literally, its just I only saw and was shown the symbolical value.
The decadence factor is one that is painfully obvious with these people… their Luxury cars/airplanes/huge mansion they live in on their sprawling Texas estate their private airport their cattle ranch… their “investments” in real estate and building companies.. yes all in all they are very very wealthy people financially …but their spirituality is definitely tainted with evil,greed and power… as most televangelists go the copelands sense of dress is conservative to say the least but unlike many previous televangelists the Copelands have learned all the “tricks of the trade” as far as not looking overly outlandish on their TV shows and meetings…so as to appear “normal people” to their many unfortunate followers.. however you only need to look just a tiny bit closer to see the evil that really exists within these people… Their “god” is wealth and prosperity they worship the almighty Dollar$$$$$$
As for their “youthfull” appearance…thats not the work of any God moreso the work of Skillfull makeup artists and Cosmetic surgeons.
i wanted to add to this because i just told this dream to someone about 2 days ago. it was from long ago, and it was a beginning of teaching by the Holy Spirit and moving in discernment. i have never posted this anywhere and the names are irrelevant at this time, but the lesson speaks loud and clear for those that have ears to hear.
in the dream i went into a building. it looked like a house. when i got inside i realized it was a church. i saw all the people talking and smiling and nodding at one another and then i noticed chairs in rows beyond where all the people were gathered and talking.
i thought at first that they all looked happy, and i longed
to feel accepted and at home, but then i noticed that they
were starting to puff up and their faces started to contort and they were pressing on each other. i realized this was evil. i was astonished to see the people continue to swell up like huge balloons and they could not
even move. there faces became snarls and the noise started to turn up, yet i couldn’t make out a single word of what was said.
i began to look for the door. the people saw me, but they could not come after me…the were all stuck together. i
found the doorway. when i got there i saw a few people that were trying to get out but a huge snake was in front of the door. the snake was about one story high when i approached. everyone was cowered back and afraid to move.
what i just left was so hideous that the snake seemed much easier to deal with at that moment, because i knew that i needed to get out of there. i was frightened but went forward and grabbed the snake. it sank its fangs into me,
yet i shook it off and through it aside. all of us at the door got out.
when i awoke in the morning i had two deep purple bruise marks on my arm at the same place. i realized that what God had shown me was real. i was a new believer and had a false prophet come up along side of me. i didn’t know the
word yet, so for 4 months of knowing this woman, it took about 4 years to get free from her outreach. this is the
work of a viper, and my friend the other night named it exactly that. that was almost 20 years ago.
God protected me, and taught me through a dream and delivered me through the gift of discernment by His Holy
Spirit and began walking with me through my dreams and the Word of God.
we cannot allow others to think for us and hear for us. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. so
we all have to keep close to the Word and walk in the light and truth we are given with Jesus.
kg
I am confused. I used to watch the Copeland’s and thought they were ok. I am not sure what to believe now. I have always thought kenneth was ok, and truthfully I never really liked Gloria but I always thought it was because our personallities clashed, not because she was doing something wrong. Now I wonder if it was God letting me know about her. Hmmmmmmmm. Well, the only thing I can say is I don’t wish harm to anyone, Gloria included, and if she is like what has been claimed here then we all need to lift her up in prayer and pray that God helps her. It’s not too late.
Angel: because she is on Christian TV and is widely accepted in Pentecostal circles, people think she is OK. You listen to some things and it sounds orthodox enough. I certainly did not know she was bad. However, if you look beyond the surface at these guys, both Kenneth and Gloria, you’ll see heresy galore – and it does not take much digging. This is in addition to their greed and their lavish lifestyle. I am ’shocked’ that Christian TV allows them on, well I am not really shocked as I know they are all about money, but you know what I mean.
Some of Copeland’s numerous heresies: (from http://www.bereanfaith.com/heresy.php?action=aquote&id=7)
If you are a new believer or do not know the bible well, I advise don’t read this garbage of Copeland’s as it may damage your faith, but know enough to know it is major trash talk and heresy.
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Jesus was infected/injected with satan’s sin nature in order for redemption to work
“He [Jesus] is suffering all that there is to suffer. There is no suffering left apart from Him. His emaciated, poured out, little, wormy spirit is down in the bottom of that thing [hell]. And the Devil thinks he’s got Him destroyed.”
Kenneth Copeland (Believer’s Voice of Victory program, April 21, 1991)
“The righteousness of God was made to be sin. He accepted the sin nature of Satan in His own spirit. And at the moment that He did so, He cried, ‘My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken Me?’ You don’t know what happened at the cross. Why do you think Moses, upon instruction of God, raised the serpent upon that pole instead of a lamb? That used to bug me. I said, ‘Why in the world would you want to put a snake up there — the sign of Satan? Why didn’t you put a lamb on that pole?’ And the Lord said, ‘Because it was a sign of Satan that was hanging on the cross.’ He said, ‘I accepted, in My own spirit, spiritual death; and the light was turned off.”
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, 1990, audiotape #02-0017, side 2)
Jesus “put Himself into the hands of Satan when He went to that cross, and took that same nature that Adam did [when he sinned].”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Incarnation, 1985, audiotape #01-0402, side 1)
Jesus is said to have remarked, “It was a sign of Satan that was hanging on the cross….I accepted, in my own spirit, spiritual death; and the light was turned off.”?
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, 1990, audiotape #02-0017, side 2)
[Jesus] “had to give up His righteousness”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Incarnation, 1985, audiotape #01-0402, side 2)
“How did Jesus then on the cross say, ‘My God.’ Because God was not His Father any more. He took upon Himself the nature of Satan. And I’m telling you Jesus is in the middle of that pit. He’s suffering all that there is to suffer, there is no suffering left . . . apart from Him. His emaciated, little wormy spirit is down in the bottom of that thing and the devil thinks He’s got Him destroyed. But, all of a sudden God started talking.”
Kenneth Copeland (Believer’s Voice of Victory, TBN, April 21, 1991)
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The cross wasn’t enough, Jesus redeemed us in hell
“When Jesus cried, ‘It is finished!’ He was not speaking of the plan of redemption. There were still three days and nights to go through before He went to the throne…Jesus’ death on the cross was only the beginning of the complete work of redemption.”
Kenneth Copeland (Jesus — Our Lord of Glory, Believer’s Voice of Victory Magazine 10, 4; April 1982, p. 3)
“Satan conquered Jesus on the Cross and took His spirit to the dark regions of hell”?
Kenneth Copeland (Holy Bible: Kenneth Copeland Reference Edition, 1991, p.129)
“He [Jesus] allowed the devil to drag Him into the depths of hell….He allowed Himself to come under Satan’s control…every demon in hell came down on Him to annihilate Him….They tortured Him beyond anything anybody had ever conceived. For three days He suffered everything there is to suffer.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Price of It All, 3)
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Jesus died spiritually
“Jesus had to go through that same spiritual death in order to pay the price. Now it wasn’t the physical death on the cross that paid the price for sin, because if it had of been any prophet of God that had died for the last couple of thousand years before that could have paid that price. It wasn’t physical death anybody could do that.”?
Kenneth Copeland (What Satan Saw on the Day of Pentecost, audio tape #020022)
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Jesus was the first born again man
“He allowed the devil to drag Him into the depths of hell as if He were the most wicked sinner who ever lived … Every demon in hell came down on Him to annihilate Him … [They] tortured Him beyond anything that anybody has ever conceived … In a thunder of spiritual force, the voice of God spoke to the death-whipped, broken, punished spirit of Jesus … [in] the pit of destruction, and charged the spirit of Jesus with resurrection power! Suddenly His twisted, death-wracked spirit began to fill out and come back to life … He was literally being reborn before the devil’s very eyes. He began to flex His spiritual muscles … Jesus Christ dragged Satan up and down the halls of hell … Jesus … was raised up a born-again man … The day I realized that a born-again man had defeated Satan, hell, and death, I got so excited … !”
Kenneth Copeland (”The Price of it All,” Believer’s Voice of Victory, September 1991, p. 4)
“In hell He [Jesus] suffered for you and for me. The Bible says hell was made for Satan and his angels. It was not made for men. Satan was holding the Son of God there illegally … The trap was set for Satan and Jesus was the bait.”
Kenneth Copeland (Walking in the Realm of the Miraculous, 1979, p. 77)
“The Spirit of God spoke to me and He said, “Son, realize this. Now follow me in this and don’t let your tradition trip you up.” He said, “Think this way — a twice-born man whipped Satan in his own domain.” And I threw my Bible down… like that. I said, “What?” He said, “A born-again man defeated Satan, the firstborn of many brethren defeated him.” He said, “You are the very image, the very copy of that one.” I said, “Goodness, gracious sakes alive!” And I began to see what had gone on in there, and I said, “Well now you don’t mean, you couldn’t dare mean, that I could have done the same thing?” He said, “Oh yeah, if you’d had the knowledge of the Word of God that He did, you could have done the same thing, ’cause you’re a reborn man too.”
Kenneth Copeland (Substitution and Identification, tape #00-0202, side 2)
” …that Word of the Living God went down into that pit of destruction and charges the spirit of Jesus with resurrection power! Suddenly, His twisted, death-wracked spirit began to fill out and come back to life. He began to look like something the devil has never seen before. He was literally being reborn before the devil’s very eyes. He began to flex his spiritual muscles… Jesus was born again — the firstborn from the dead.”
Kenneth Copeland (The Price of it All, Believer’s Voice in Victory, vol 19 September 1991, p.9)
“He [Jesus] was down in that pit and there he suffered the punishment for three horrible days and nights for Adam’s treason… There is a new birth takes place in the very depths of the earth, when the command of God says ‘That’s enough, loose him and let him go’.”
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, 1990, audiotape #02-0017, side 2)
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Anyone could have redeemed us
“It wasn’t a physical death on the cross that paid the price for sin…anybody can do that.”?
Kenneth Copeland (What Satan Saw on the Day of Pentecost, audiotape #BCC-19, side 1)
“Every prophet that walked the face of the earth under the Abrahamic covenant could have paid the price if it were a physical death only. When He said ‘It is finished’ on that cross, He was not speaking of the plan of redemption. The plan of redemption had just begun; there were still three days and three nights to be gone through.”
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, 1990, audiotape #02-0017, side 2)
“The Spirit of God spoke to me and He said, “Son, realize this. Now follow me in this and don’t let your tradition trip you up.” He said, “Think this way — a twice-born man whipped Satan in his own domain.” And I threw my Bible down… like that. I said, “What?” He said, “A born-again man defeated Satan, the firstborn of many brethren defeated him.” He said, “You are the very image, the very copy of that one.” I said, “Goodness, gracious sakes alive!” And I began to see what had gone on in there, and I said, “Well now you don’t mean, you couldn’t dare mean, that I could have done the same thing?” He said, “Oh yeah, if you’d had the knowledge of the Word of God that He did, you could have done the same thing, ’cause you’re a reborn man too.”
Kenneth Copeland (Substitution and Identification, 1989, tape #00-0202, side 2)
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The church is in control, not God
“As a believer, you have a right to make commands in the name of Jesus. Each time you stand on the Word, you are commanding God to a certain extent because it is His Word.”
Kenneth Copeland (Our Covenant with God, 1987, p. 32)
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God is banned from the earth until the church unleashes him/allows him in
“God’s on the outside looking in. He doesn’t have any legal entree into the earth. The thing don’t belong to Him. You see how sassy the Devil was in the presence of God in the book of Job? God said, “Where have you been?” Wasn’t any of God’s business. He [Satan] didn’t even have to answer if he didn’t want to … God didn’t argue with him a bit! You see, this is the position that God’s been in … Might say, “Well, if God’s running things He’s doing a lousy job of it.” He hadn’t been running ‘em, except when He’s just got, you know, a little bit of a chance.”
Kenneth Copeland (Image of God in You III, 1989, audiotape #01-1403, side 1)
“Here’s where we’re gonna depart from ordinary church: Now, you see, God is injecting His Word into the earth to produce this Jesus — these faith-filled words that framed the image that’s in Him … He can’t just walk onto the earth and say, “Let it be!” because He doesn’t have the right. He had to sneak it in here around the god of this world that was blockin’ every way that he possibly could.”
Kenneth Copeland (The Image of God in You III, 1989, audiotape #01-1403, side 2)
“The Bible says that God gave this earth to the sons of men … and when [Adam] turned and gave that dominion to Satan, look where it left God. If left Him on the outside looking in … He had no legal right to do anything about it, did He? … He had injected Himself illegally into the earth — what Satan had intended for Him to do was to fall for it — pull off an illegal act and turn the light off in God, and subordinate God to himself … He intended to get God into such a trap that He couldn’t get out.”
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, 1990, audiotape #02-0017)
“Adam committed high treason, and at that point, all the dominion and authority God had given to him was handed over to Satan. Suddenly, God was on the outside looking in … After Adam’s fall, God found Himself in a peculiar position … God needed an avenue back into the earth … God laid out His proposition and Abram accepted it. It gave God access to the earth and gave man access to God … Technically, if God ever broke the Covenant, He would have to destroy Himself.”
Kenneth Copeland (Our Covenant with God, 1987, pp. 8-11)
“God had no avenue of lasting faith or moving in the earth. He had to have covenant with somebody. He had to be invited in, in other words, or He couldn’t come. God is on the outside looking in. In order to have any say so in the earth, He’s going to have to be in agreement with a man here.”
Kenneth Copeland (God’s Covenants With Man II, 1985, audiotape #01-4404, side 1)
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These men think they’re Gods!
“Jesus is no longer the only begotten Son of God.”
Kenneth Copeland (Now We Are In Christ Jesus, 1980, p. 24)
“You are not a spiritual schizophrenic — half-God and half-Satan — you are all-God”?
Kenneth Copeland (Now We Are in Christ Jesus, 1980, p.16-17)
“You don’t have a god in you, you are one”
Kenneth Copeland (The Force of Love, 1987, audiotape #02-0028, side 1)
“I say this with all respect so that it don’t upset you too bad, but I say it anyway. When I read in the Bible where he [Jesus] says, ‘I Am,’ I just smile and say, ‘Yes, I Am, too!’”
Kenneth Copeland (Believer’s Voice of Victory, TBN July 9, 1987)
“Now Peter said by exceeding great and precious promises you become partakers of the divine class. All right, are we gods? We are a class of gods!”?
Kenneth Copeland (Praise The Lord, TBN February 5, 1986)
“Adam was created in God’s own image and likeness, a spirit-being…[and] takes on the nature of his spiritual father or lord.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Our Covenant with God, 1987, p.7-8)
“Gods reason for creating Adam was his desire to reproduce himself. I mean a reproduction of Himself. And in the Garden of Eden He did just that. He was not a little like God, He was not almost like God, He was not subordinate to God even … Adam was as much like God as you can get, just the same as Jesus. Adam in the Garden of Eden was God manifested in the flesh”
Kenneth Copeland (Following the faith of Abraham Audio, #01-3001 side 1)
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The Anointing
“Believers are not to be led by logic,” he writes. “We are not even to be led by good sense”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Force of Faith, 7)
“You have the same creative faith and ability on the inside of you that God used when he created the heavens and the earth.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Inner Image of the Covenant, side 2)
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The 100 fold theory
“Do you want a hundredfold return on your money? Give and let God multiply it back to you. He urges his supporters, “Invest heavily in God; the returns are staggering, … “Every man who invests in the Gospel has a right to expect the staggering return of one hundredfold.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Laws of Prosperity , pg.67)
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The importance of earthly riches
“The basic principle of the Christian life is to know that God put our sin, sickness, disease, sorrow, grief, and poverty on Jesus at Calvary,” he asserts. “For Him to put any of this on us now would be a miscarriage of justice.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Troublemaker, 6)
“Well, they say, you need balance in this, get out there in that hyper faith, that name-it-and-claim-it, that blab-it-and-grab-it. YEAH! We named it and claimed it and got it. (crowd cheers) Blabbed it and grabbed it and still got it ! Hallelujah! And our bills are paid.”
Kenneth Copeland (speaking at John Hagee’s Church, August 18, 1999)
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Health is yours for the claiming
“You began to meditate on those scriptures until you built an inner image of yourself healed. As that image grew more crisp and clear, you began to expect — or hope for — that image to become a reality. Eventually, faith rose up, put substance to that internal image and turned it into an external reality. That spiritual process always works the same way. Hope forms the image according to the Word, then faith rises up and gives substance to that image, making it a reality in the natural, physical realm. … Actually, what you did is activate the scriptural process described in Hebrews 11:1 “Faith is the substance of things hoped for … Boil it down to its simplest form, and you could write it like this: God’s Word+Hope+Faith=Manifestation! … You’ll be expecting the very presence of God to rise up in you so powerfully that instead of believing for healing every six weeks, you’ll walk in divine health every day!”
Kenneth Copeland (”Expect The Glory”, Believer’s Voice of Victory magazine, January 1998, p. 5)
“… It wasn’t Peter’s shadow that healed them. What was it? That field of Glory that surrounded him. That’s what [sic] God put hope in you to expect. The Glory! … It will flood the earth when we meditate upon the Glory of God so much that hope rises up and produces an image. Then faith will release the Glory of God from the inside of us where we can’t see it to the outside where we can see it! … Does this sound wild to you? Well, it’s not! If you’ll go back and read the Bible, you’ll see that’s what Christianity is all about. God intended for the Body of Christ to walk through this earth with such a manifestation of His presence in our lives that it would either scare people spitless … or draw them into the Kingdom of God!”
Kenneth Copeland (”Expect The Glory”, Believer’s Voice of Victory magazine, January 1998, p. 6)
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Results of lack of faith
“God cannot do anything for you apart or separate from faith,”?
Kenneth Copeland (Freedom from Fear, 1983, 11)
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4th Dimension of non-carnal attainment
“Pray to yourself, because I’m in your self and you’re in My self. We are one Spirit, saith the Lord.”
Kenneth Copeland (”Believer’s Voice of Victory”, Feb. 1987, p.9)
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The faith force
“Faith is a power force,” he claims. “It is a tangible force. It is a conductive force.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Force of Faith, 1989, 10)
“Faith is a spiritual force….It is substance. Faith has the ability to effect natural substance.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Forces of the Recreated Human Spirit, 1982,
“The force of gravity…makes the law of gravity work…this force of faith…makes the laws of the spirit world function.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Laws of Prosperity, 1974, 18-19)
“Faith is God’s source of power”?
Kenneth Copeland (Forces of the Recreated Human Spirit, 1982,
“Faith was the raw material substance that the Spirit of God used to form the universe.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Authority of the Believer II, 1987, audiotape #01-0302, side 1)
“The force of faith was controlling His (Jesus’) ministry.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Force of Faith, 9)
“Man was created to know that great life force and he longs for it in his dreams. Adam had that life force in him before he committed high treason”?
Kenneth Copeland (What Happened from the Cross to the Throne, side 2)
“God did not create the world out of nothing, He used the Force of His Faith.”
Kenneth Copeland (pirit, Soul, & Body, #01-0601, Tape #1)
“Faith is God’s source of power”?
Kenneth Copeland (Freedom From Fear, 1983. p. 12)
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Words are spiritual containers
“Words are spiritual containers,”?
Kenneth Copeland (Forces of the Recreated Human Spirit, 15; cf. 14)
The “force of faith is released by words.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Authority of the Believer II, 1987, audiotape #01-0302, side 1)
“God used words when He created the heaven and the earth….Each time God spoke, He released His faith — the creative power to bring His words to pass.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Power of the Tongue, 1980, 4)
“As a born-again believer, you are equipped with the Word. You have the power of God at your disposal. By getting the Word deep into your spirit and speaking it boldly out your mouth, you release spiritual power to change things in the natural circumstances.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Power of the Tongue, 1980, 15)
“Words create pictures, and pictures in your mind create words. And then the words come back out your mouth….And when that spiritual force comes out it is going to give substance to the image that’s on the inside of you. Aw, that’s that visualization stuff! Aw, that’s that New Age! No, New Age is trying to do this; and they’d get somewhat results out of it because this is spiritual law, brother.”
Kenneth Copeland (Believer’s Voice of Victory, TBN, March 28, 1991)
“Words are the most sacred things….This is a word planet…governed by words…created by words….Words cause it to function…cause life…cause death….Words go on forever….Words are holy.”?
Kenneth Copeland (The Abrahamic Covenant, side 1)
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Sensual manifestations
“Everything that you’re able to see or touch, anything that you can feel, anything that’s perceptive to the five physical senses, was originally the faith of God, and was born in the substance of God’s faith.”
Kenneth Copeland (Spirit, Soul, & Body Part 1, 1985, audiotape #01-0601, side 1)
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Above Reproach – testing their spirits
[Copeland claims Jesus told him personally in a vision:] “Don’t be disturbed when people put you down and speak harshly and roughly of you. They spoke that way of Me, should they not speak that way of you? The more you get to be like Me, the more they’re going to think that way of you. They crucified Me for claiming that I was God. But I didn’t claim I was God; I just claimed I walked with Him and He was in Me. Hallelujah. That’s what you’re doing.”
Kenneth Copeland (”Take Time To Pray,” Believer’s Voice of Victory 15, February 1987, 9)
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God is the biggest failure in the bible
“I was shocked when I found out who the biggest failure in the Bible actually is…The biggest one in the whole Bible is God…I mean, He lost His top-ranking, most anointed angel; the first man He ever created; the first woman He ever created; the whole earth and all the fullness therein; a third of the angels, at least – that’s a big loss, man….Now, the reason you don’t think of God as a failure is He never said He’s a failure. And you’re not a failure till you say you’re one.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Praise-a-thon on Praise The Lord, April 1988)
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Jesus was raped by Roman soldiers
“Let me tell you something folks. Anybody in here that’s ever been sexually abused, listen to me right now. Listen to me very carefully. The Bible’s very careful about the way it says these things. But down there in that dungeon, Romans, ungodly men, ungodly men, put Him (Jesus) to every kind of abuse that you can think of. There is no sin that Jesus didn’t bare. There is no thing, there is no such thing as a sexual abuse on somebody that Jesus doesn’t know firsthand what it’s all about. He’s been where you are. I don’t care what you’ve been through, Jesus has been through it. And everythings done to him that we couldn’t even speak of.”
Kenneth Copeland (The Resurrection Truth)
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God’s physical description
“God spoke Adam into existence in authority with words. These words struck Adam’s body in the face. His body and God’s were exactly the same size.”
Kenneth Copeland (Holy Bible, Kenneth Copeland Reference Edition 1991, p. 45)
“If you stood Adam upside God, they look just exactly alike….If you stood Jesus and Adam side-by-side, they would look and act and sound exactly alike….The image is that they look just alike, but the likeness is that they act alike and they are alike….All of God’s attributes, all of God’s authority, all of God’s faith, all of God’s ability was invested in that man.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Authority of the Believer IV? 1987, audiotape #01-0304), side 1)
“The Bible said He measured the heavens with a 9 inch span. Now the span is the difference, distance between the end of the thumb and the end of the little Finger. And, and that Bible said, in fact the amplified translation translates the Hebrew text that way. That He measured out the heavens with a 9 inch span. Well, I got a ruler and measured mine, and my span’s 8 3/4 inches long. So now God’s span is a quarter of an inch, a quarter inch longer than mine. So you see, that faith didn’t come billowing out of some giant monster somewhere. It came out of the heart of a being that is very uncanny the way He’s very much like you and me. A being that stands somewhere around 6′ 2 “, 6′ 3″, that weighs somewhere in the neighbourhood of a couple of hundred pounds, little better, has a span of 8 and, I mean nine inches across – stood up and said “Light be [Let it be?]“, and this universe situated itself and went into motion. Glory to God.”
Kenneth Copeland (”pirit, Soul, & Body Part 1″ 1985, audio tape #01-0601, side 1)
God is a “spirit-being with a body, complete with eyes, and eyelids, ears, nostrils, a mouth, hands and fingers, and feet.”
Kenneth Copeland (Kenneth Copeland ministry letter, 21 July 1977)
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The Womb-Man
“Adam was made in the image of God. He was as much female as he was male. He was exactly like God. Then God separated him and removed the female part. Woman means ‘man with the womb.’ Eve had as much authority as Adam did as long as they stayed together.”
Kenneth Copeland (Sensitivity of Heart, KCP Publications, 1984, p. 23)
“Then, he created Eve out of Adam. Now, actually God didn’t name her Eve, Adam named her Eve later. That wasn’t her name, her name was Adam … Adam. When God said Adam, they both came. Their authority was one and the same together. They did everything together. They had always been together. Even when she was still part of him, he was as much female as he was male, LIKE GOD IS. And God separated the female part of him and then put them back together. And she was Adam, they were Adam. He was the man, she was the woman. She was the man with the womb.”
Kenneth Copeland ((Transcribed From A Message Given By Kenneth Copeland, Paw Creek Ministries) )
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God lives on the mother planet
“Heaven has a north and a south and an east and a west. Consequently, it must be a planet.”?
Kenneth Copeland (Following the Faith of Abraham I, 1989 audiotape, #01-3001, side 1)
“You don’t think earth was first, do you? Huh? Well, you don’t think that God made man in His image, and then made earth in some other image? There is not anything under this whole sun that’s new. Are you hearing what I’m saying? This is all a copy. It’s a copy of home. It’s a copy of the Mother Planet. Where God lives, He made a little one just like His and put us on it.”
Kenneth Copeland (Following the Faith of Abraham I, 1989 audiotape, #01-3001, side 1)
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I have met and/or spoken to Jesus
(Relating Jesus speaking) “Don’t be disturbed when people put you down and speak harshly and roughly of you. They spoke that way of Me, should they not speak that way of you? The more you get to be like Me, the more they’re going to think that way of you. They crucified Me for claiming that I was God. But I didn’t claim I was God; I just claimed I walked with Him and that He was in Me. Hallelujah.”
Kenneth Copeland (”Take Time to Pray,” Believer’s Voice of Victory, February 1987, p. 9)
“Jesus went into hell to free mankind from the penalty of Adam’s high treason…When His blood poured out it did not atone. Jesus spent three horrible days and nights in the bowels of this earth getting back for you and me our rights with God.” (Ken Copeland, Personal letter from Ken Copeland, Ft. Worth Texas, March 12, 1979. (D. R. McConnell, A Different Gospel, page 118)
“The Spirit of God spoke to me and He said, ‘Son, realize this. Now follow me in this and don’t let your tradition trip you up.’ He said, ‘Think this way – a twice-born man whipped Satan in his own domain.’ And I threw my Bible down…like that. I said, ‘What?’ He said, ‘A born-again man defeated Satan, the firstborn of many brethren defeated him.’ He said, ‘You are the very image, the very copy of that one.’ I said, ‘Goodness, gracious sakes alive!’ And I began to see what had gone on in there, and I said, ‘Well now you don’t mean, you couldn’t dare mean, that I could have done the same thing?’ He said, ‘Oh yeah, if you’d had the knowledge of the Word of God that He did, you could have done the same thing, ’cause you’re a reborn man too.” (Dr. John MacArthur, “Charismatic Chaos,” page 337. Kenneth Copeland, “Substitution and Identification”)
“I was shocked when I found out who the biggest failure in the Bible actually is…The biggest one in the whole Bible is God…I mean, He lost His top-ranking, most anointed angel; the first man He ever created; the first woman He ever created; the whole earth and all the fullness therein; a third of the angels, at least – that’s a big loss, man….Now, the reason you don’t think of God as a failure is He never said He’s a failure. And you’re not a failure till you say you’re one.” (Ken Copeland, Audio-Clip “Christianity in Crisis,” Hank Hanegraaff)
“I’ve had ugly books written about me because I said that Jesus died spiritually, but the fact is, I didn’t say thatthe Bible said it. Jesus became our substitute. If he hadn’t died spiritually, then we could never have been made alive spiritually. But He did! On the cross, Jesus was separated from the glory of God. He allowed Himself to be made sin for us, and He became obedient to death. He went into the pit of hell and suffered there as though He was the One Who had committed the sin.” (Ken Copeland, “The Power of His Resurrection”)
“God’s purpose and plan–the deepest desire of His heart–is coming to pass. God is going to have a family of equals!” (Kenneth Copeland, “Fullness: God’s Plan For His Family,” BVOV Magazine, July & August 2004, page 32)
“If you stood Adam upside God, they look just exactly alike….If you stood Jesus and Adam side-by-side, they would look and act and sound exactly alike….The image is that they look just alike, but the likeness is that they act alike and they are alike….All of God’s attributes, all of God’s authority, all of God’s faith, all of God’s ability was invested in that man.”(Kenneth Copeland, Authority of the Believer IV (Fort Worth: Kenneth Copeland Ministries, 1987, audiotape #01-0304), side 1
“You can have what you say! In fact, what you are saying is exactly what you are getting now. If you are living in poverty and lack and want, change what you are saying. It will change what you have…Discipline your vocabulary. Discipline everything you do, everything you say, and everything you think to agree with what God does, what God says, and what God thinks. God will be obligated to meet your needs because of His Word….If you stand firmly on this, your needs will be met.” (D. R. McConnell, A Different Gospel, page 172. Ken Copeland, “The Laws of Prosperity,” page 98, 101)
“He [Jesus] allowed the devil to drag Him into the depths of hell….He allowed Himself to come under Satan’s control…every demon in hell came down on Him to annihilate Him….They tortured Him beyond anything anybody had ever conceived. For three days He suffered everything there is to suffer.” (Kenneth Copeland, “The Price of It All,” page 3.
“It takes money to preach the gospel. Jesus Himself knew that, and contrary to what some people think, His ministry was not a poor one. He had so much money coming in and going out through His ministry that He had to appoint a treasurer. His name was Judas.” (Kenneth Copeland, “From Faith to Faith A Daily Guide to Victory,” December 5)
Yes those and many more heresies the Copelands have spouted over many years(40 in all i believe)these people are spiritually evil…their soul existence is money and prosperity based..very sad indeed for the many “followers” they have accumulated along the way.
Question for Angel, you said….I never really liked Gloria but I always thought it was because our personallities clashed,?
Just a curiosity how so did your Personalities clash? do you have a personal(church) relationship with the Copeland ministry? or is it merely her words or appearance that bothers you?
Wow Lord help us all. Just how many people we think we can help thats how many we can harm. The devil is a very cunning creature and he knows religion all to well. He knows how to twist scripture which are Gods word to make you think you are right in whatever stand you take. Only the holyspirit can discern truth and error and to publically denounce the copelands ministry with promise of such grave consequence if Gloria doesnt repent is such a declaration that in my estimation should come by God through his power to Gloria. My coming across it fills no purpose other than to confuse me as well as the reader who thought they were ok untill he came across this blog. Confusion of any kind is not of God neither is the one who causes it
Notnewtoblog: there is nothing at all confusing or duplicitous as to what I have said, it is perfectly clear as is God’s word about publically rebuking false or greedy teachers. So you are confused because something you thought was Ok is proven to be not? Would you rather stay in darkness, is this what you are saying?
The Holy Spirit is the whom speaks through me and gives me the visions and prophecy and is the one who will testify to the truth of this if you will but listen! Besides which, you do not need to be a prophet to discern the Copelands are heretics.
If you are confused, this is not from me or from God! Read the word of God on this and trust in scripture and not man! And in future use your discernment more against any teachers for you can be led stray by assuming they are OK and not testing them.
Just a few of hundreds of webpages of Copelands Many heresies for Notnewtoblog to peruse at will… very interesting reading and exposay…
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/false_prophets.htm
http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/copeland/general.htm
http://www.independentconservative.com/2007/09/18/ken_copeland_heresies/
Enjoy
There are literally thousands of web sites and web pages exposing copelands many heresies simply google “Kenneth Copeland Fraud”
“The holy sprit is speaking through you” You teach the Copelands and others are false yet you teach that I should believe yours is the voice of Gods spirit. That instead of correcting Gloria or any other false prophets the holy spirits speaks to you and has you to set it up on this web page to tell people like me the consequences or fate that he (holy spirit) will render to them? If I were to break that down in laymans terms it sounds like, dont believe them believe me, they dont know God but I do, what they say is false and they are doomed to hell but I am the voice of God listen to me. You sound just as antichrist as you say they are. Im not accusing you to be I just am relaying to you what it sounds like to me. an anti Christ is one who tries to take the place of Christ. i.e. im right and he is wrong ect. and for the record other than occaisional browses on their tv show I dont watch them, I was just interested in your very straight foward and bold prophecy
notnewtoblog: don’t believe either of us, believe the Bible. I hold to that and the Copeland’s clearly don’t but claim they do. The warning is for those who are deceived by them, to examine their teachings in the real light of truth.
An antichrist contradicts the Bible, and also the truth of Jesus Christ. Do you see any of that on this blog? Do you see me trying to take the place of Christ – anywere, anyhow?! An antichrist is not one who warns about errant teachers (sigh).
Read your Bible better before making such silly accusations.
How sad to read this “prophecy” about Gloria Copeland. I sincerely hope for YOUR sake that you are correct because God also says “touch not my annointed” and He will I believe, judge all false prophecy and loose words we speak (me included). I am not God and I cannot see Gloria’s heart, and I think it rare that God tells OTHER PEOPLE about the condition of our individual hearts – he tells us to discern others by their FRUIT (deeds). Was that Gloria you saw in your dream or a vision of yourself – a vision of how YOU see others maybe? Did you interpret your dream according to all of scripture?
Regarding the character and integrity of Gloria Copeland – I can only speak from my personal experience with this Godly woman. Years ago, I was a Christian and belonged to a so-called good church. One day, I found myself sick, isolated and lost in a dark deep pit of bondage – noone from my own church came to my aid nor seemed to care. I came close to taking my own life and the life of my unborn child because of the sheer torment of this trial. However, in a last desperate pitch, I cried out to God for mercy, deliverance and most of all revelation and understanding about what was happening to me. Within weeks, He led me to Gloria Copeland’s ministry and used the annointing on this lady to restore my soul and restore my shaky relationship with Him. God set me free from years of torment through this lady. Why on earth would He do that if this lady is so wicked?? Why did he not use someone from my local church?
The Bible says that prophecy is meant to encourage and edify – I find the tone of your “prophecy” about this woman of God extremely judgemental – It is so sad that you say these things about a lady who loves the Lord with all her heart, is obedient to God, gives abundantly to the poor and the oppressed, and is passionate for souls – THAT is why she is so blessed – and THAT is why she has received the promises of God in such rich fullness. Greed has nothing to do with it! Is there perhaps a little bit of King Saul’s jealousy in your own heart which then opens the door to error in what you are “seeing”?? How much time or money do you spend in minstering to the poor overseas? I know from a reputable personal source that the Copelands send millions of dollars to overseas missions and projects to aid the poor and needy and to get the gospel out- not to mention risking their lives by going into dangerous parts of the world just to preach the gospel – they just do it the Bible way (without telling anyone or publicly bragging about it). How often do you spend on your knees praying and fasting for the lost like they do? Would you fearlessly risk your life for the gospel? The Copelands are BLESSED OF GOD and that is what annoys you. Sad.
HisOwn: God can use wicked things, events and people including pharoah and the King of Asyria and the army of the North for his own purposes, so the fact God may or may not use Gloria to help you is not at all relevant and no indicator of her current holiness or soundness.
So you consider the Copelands to be scriptural and not in error? Really?!!!! After all they do and teach?!!! It seems that for all their blessings and good works they did not lead you into truth then, did they?
How much of a blessing is it to you that they lead you into such obvious error, not to mention blasphemy? If you’d gone into any religion or cult you’d proabbly initially feel happy and free and blessed. It is the long run – your salvation – that matters as well as of course truth. Do you also think it ok they live in such decadent wealth at your expense and preach another Jesus? Oh that’s right they are blessed and I’m just jealous! (Not!)
How blind you are to scripture about false teachers and greedy shepherds and what these people are really about, as they have led you to another gospel and another Jesus entirely.
yeah right!
You also need to do a better Bible study on prophecy too, what it is and is not….as well as a better study of the whole Bible.
Dear End Times
Such a shame that you spend all of your time and energy accusing your brothers and sisters in Christ on this website rather than praying and preaching the gospel to the dying and hurting.
Your information and evidence about these people is distorted and out of context. When you are busy pounding your keyboard with your latest findings about these people, do ever question your motives?
Just curious, when you are alone with the Holy Spirit – do you ever ask Him – “could I be the one who is deceived?”. Do you ever ask the Holy Spirit – “please show me the error of MY ways instead of others today Lord”.
The Great Commission: and of course you are the expert as to what I do and do not do with my time outside this blog?
You are also distorted to say I spend all my time accusing heretics, most of the other information on this blog is not on these matters at all.
Just curious, when YOU are alone with the Holy Spirit – do you ever ask Him – am I right about this before I accuse anybody of anything?
I am in prophetic ministy in that I know how to test and weigh up a word before giving it. I know what my motives were and are in regards to being obedient to listening and passing on this whole message as I saw and heard it. I also know about searching my own heart and seeking God’s word for myself too, not to say I am perfect, but who is.
For the record, I never asked God for information on Gloria Copeland, it was God who chose to speak to me on this ‘out of the blue’. You might want to ask God about it before continuing to accuse me, his servant, of having impure motives etc.
If you feel there are inaccuracies, perhaps you’d like to say what and where exactly.
You have already shown your own rank hypocrisy by pretending to be somebody else when in fact you are also ‘Hisown’, the previous poster, which I know. Why pretend you are someone else? Can’t your argument stand or fall on its own without bringing in the fake cavalry.
Just read your reply to my comment before going to bed. I am not at all surprised by the intensity of your words – they are full of spiritual pride and bitterness. So sad when Jesus said that the world would know Him by the way we (us Christians) love one another.
It would seem that you profess to know the Word better than I (and others) so what more can I say? I refuse to argue with you – especially about God’s precious Holy Word.
You are passionate about the truth (I too) so that is one thing we can agree on then – that one of us is indeed in error. I will simply therefore pray for both of us tonight that God will reveal His truth to both of us.
I sincerely hope to meet you in heaven cos I won’t be back on this site again now. I will pray for you tonight and ask the Lord to bless you and your family abundantly. If you don’t know Jesus as your personal friend and saviour I pray also He will reveal His love to you – sounds like you could do with it.
In Jesus
HisOwn
LOL. You should be a detective rather than an prophet!
I really have got better things to do (like praying) than be on this site being “exposed” by an angry prophet of God.
Seriously, I bless you in the name of Jesus and hope to meet you in heaven and give you a big hug.
Yours in Jesus
HisOwn
>they are full of spiritual pride and bitterness
Not at all. If we are to judge who is the obvious false prophets here, me or the Copelands, one impartial look at scripture will readily tell us this. Yet you judge me and do not seem to know scripture well at all to test heresy and also to know what prophecy is and is not and what refuting heresy and rebuking false teachers is. It is a simple enough statement to say you need to know the word of God better – it is not judgmental, it is fact – if you are not enlightened on these relatively basic points. Neither is it unloving not to point this out. In fact the unloving thing would be to stay silent and let people carry on being led astray.
If you knew scripture well, you’d know that the test of a true teacher is not whether God uses them or not, you’d know that heresy and false teaching needs rebuked, and all teachers and prophets need weighed against the word of God, and it is not unloving to speak out etc.
As to ‘exposing’ you, I call a spade a spade, as empowered by the Spirit of God. Does it make me angry? No, it makes me bold and truthful and confrontational at times. I do not play games. You should not have tried to pretend to be somebody else when wrongly accusing me and rebuking me.
I do not claim to know the word better than all others. I know it better than some others, and I also know it enough to say the Copelands are heretics with or without that vision. I have weighed them and found them wanting, you would too if you did an impartial search and removed the stars from your eyes when you scrutinized their teachings.
I hear your words which seem to come across as sweetness and light to the unaware, but they are far from sweet at source. They come from the heart of the deciever, who works in you and attempts to seduce others into error, or to keep any other who would speak quiet in the spirit of ‘love’ and ‘peace’ and ‘unity’. Let’s all join in with all the religions while at it and be at peace with everybody. This angel of light’s name is Lucifer or Satan. I am not surprised given the seriousness of the ’sweet’ error that is around the Copelands’ ministry of it thus surfacing in one of their supporters.
I too hear from the spirit of God Endtimes (Miriam?)and I have a simple word for you-
You have a religious spirit operating through you, it has entered through a bitter root taken hold in your heart.
You need to repent of unforgiveness toward Christians who have misunderstood and hurt you before it destroys you.
Endtimes, God has just spoken to me again about you and I am posting this comment not so much for you but for any others that stumble onto your site and try to reason with you.
God has revealed to me that it does not matter what you say to this person (Endtimes), how you word it, what scripture you use to back up your argument, how much love you extend, how you try to reason – this person’s heart is fixed and set in stone. Therefore everything will be trampled, twisted, distorted and thrown back into your face with the label “evil” slapped on it – not recognising the own evil in her/his own heart.
The Holy Spirit then led me to this scripture
2 Timothy 3:1-5
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, without natural affection, trucebreakers, fals accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God; having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof; from such turn away.
His/Her pride will be enraged to think that this scripture is more fitting for themself rather than all the other “false prophets” they have listed on this website!
I don’t like injustice either and my human flesh rises up when I see people like this attacking Holy things of God but the Word reminds us not to get into foolish arguments with people like this (I have to remind myself of this).
I will bow out now and let Endtimes have the last say on this Blog knowing that it will actually be God who has the last say at the Judgement Seat about these matters.
So sad to see people(and who knows exactly who these people or person are in reality..maybe KCM itself perhaps?) twisting reality to try and keep the deception alive..FACT#1: Kenneth Copeland Ministry does NOT go into any countries where they may be in any kind of personal danger… from what i know of them they do ministries in the UK /ireland/africa/australia/the US/canada/russia/singapore/and other developed nations… i might be slightly impressed if infact they went to third world countries or where they may be in some danger but that is not likely.
FACT#2.KCM bought a $20 million aircraft to get around in by using the “contributions” of gullible people with good hearts but not much foresight.. the reasons given by KCM were that it was more convenient to spread the “word” rather than using public aircraft.. more likely a fear of using public aircraft since 9/11 or for opulence sake.
Using public aircraft would have saved Tens of thousands of dollars which they could of actually used to help the needy.
(these Jets use a huge amount of fuel per hour..) and to top it off they also want their “partners” to buy good ole Gloria her own jet….yup thats right matching $20 million Jets.
It doesnt take much to open your eyes without false accusations of people calling names online to see that the whole shebang of the TBN crew and nearly all of the Name it and claim it prosperity based televangelist circuit are Fraudsters/scammers/and basically ungodly people offering God at a price$$$$$$……$$$$$$… Open your eyes stop supporting these shamsters
HisOwn aka The Great Commission: You do not know the truth, neither do you know the word of God scripturally or prophetically. You are NOT a prophet (if you were you would not contradict scripture as you do) and the Lord rebuke you for distorting scripture to your own ends and pretending to be one – do you know what it means to lie to the Spirit of God? (look up Ananias and Saphira who probably thought they meant well too.) I warn you of this lying against God, his servant and his Spirit and its implications most severely. You already showed your true colours to even non prophetic people on here by pretending to be somebody else and then you lied and said you would not be here again when I knew full well you would be! Furthermore you lied when you pretended to ‘love me’ and send me hugs. Do you think God or I are fools? Does truth need to lie or cover itself up in the cloak of pretence?
You may sincerely think you mean well and are doing ‘God’s work’ by advocating the Copelands, you are assuredly deceieved and do not live in the light, but the fact is whatever your intentions, Satan is using you to lie and lie again and accuse me, a servant of God, of evil. You lie against me and more than that against God Himself, for when you accuse me, God’s mouthpiece, of lying or falsehood or any of the other things you have when I have spoke against the Copelands, you accuse the Spirit of God of lying, of being a religious or unloving spirit etc for He is the one that has spoken this. How dare you, do you know what it means to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit? Are you in that much ignorance? Examine the truth and repent! You know also you lie, now stop it and repent and get right with God. I have warned you – assuredly God will not be mocked. This is not about me but God’s word.
There is ample evidence that what I speak is the truth. You refuse to examine the truth for you love your ‘idols’ and assumptions and own thinking over the truth. Do not think your own thinking or assumptions are ‘prophetic’ for assuredly you do not know God and his ways regarding this or many other matters, neither do you know how to listen to the true Spirit of God. You do not even know what prophecy is yet you claim to be a prophet! I sincerely hope you will push past this sin and deceit that binds you, repent and open your eyes to the truth and start living in the light, and become genuinely prophetic and spiritual in time. Then you can live in blessing and the light instead of loving the deeds of darkness and not risk eternal condemnation.
Hi Endtime, you are so ready to accuse and find sin in my heart aren’t you, yet you are blind to your own sin (accusation towards the saints and pointing the finger). You have also distorted my “motives” for leaving a comment by another alias name.
Having a business website myself, I am quite savvy about checking techniques used to see who, when and what comes through your site – so I am not ignorant of the fact that you would know when I have been on your site even if I use an alias name.
Perhaps my leaving a comment by another alias name has merely exposed your own sin (accusation and pointing the finger)?
No, I did not have any personal intention of coming back onto your site but when I heard otherwise from the Holy Spirit (to go back to face my accuser and speak into your life) I came back and left the word for you. I have come back again to face your response and condemnation with the assurance that God is my judge and not yourself (thankfully). I was sad to read your viscious response and I am aware that you will probably again twist my words and motives to reinforce your argument for judgement and accusation against me as well as totally reject any spiritual authority or prophecy manifesting through my own words – cos you have somehow exalted yourself above my authority to speak into your life.
I won’t be tempted to come back to you read your response – I just want to leave you in the hands of the Lord and would like to have sincerely said in the name of Jesus I bless you and hope to see you in Heaven, yet you have already rejected this previously by saying that it is not sincere and that my motives for saying such are deceptive and impure.
So instead – Ill call a spade a spade too and merely say I pity you and your future if you attack, judge and push away people who would genuinely love you because you are so suspicious of them and see the devil in their hearts instead of Jesus. You are very obviously convinced of this so only the Lord can break through that hardened attitude (or what I would also say good old DECEPTION). That is the one thing that you and I can at least agree on is that one of us very deceived.
HisOwn
(alias The Great Commission)
Hi Joh – Im responding to your post. No, Im not one of the KCM nor a cult follower of them. I merely respect the annointing on their lives and acknowledged in a previous post as to how God used their ministry to deliver me from a distressing trial.
Previous to this, I too, was suspicious of their ministry, from all the “talk” that I had heard and read from various “reputable” people and rather than just believing what I had heard and read and as I did not have the opportunity of meeting these people face to face because they are in a different country – I actually took it to the Lord and asked Him to reveal their hearts to me so that I could settle it in my own heart. I then got hold of some of their teaching and ministry tapes etc and began to check it out for myself, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit and continually checking it against the Word. Not long after this I was met with a very distressing trial and as noone from my own church came to my aid – apart from the Lord Himself, the Copelands ministry was all that I had to reach out to at that time. As events unfolded and I submitted to their spiritual wisdom and authority, repented of my suspicious and finger pointing attitude toward them, I found supernatural deliverance from my circumstances and my health was restored.
So the matter was settled for me – God had spoken and answered my prayer and my life has been blessed since.
I am unsure about the “FACTS” that you have about Copelands and the source of where you got it from – there are thousands of sources of information on the web about them but I would have to question how truthful these facts are. Any information I have got about them – I have got from people who personally know them through our local church here and/or from their own ministry. Of course if you are of the belief that they are liars and do not tell the truth then the research stops there doesn’t it and you are left with going to the Holy Spirit about it – which is probably the best thing to do because the Holy Spirit tells us the truth to our face when others will not.
God Bless you for standing up for truth and righteousness
His Own
His Own
You are decieved. Go by the word of God instead of by your experiences. If anyone teaches contrary to the word of God (as the Copelands) do – despite whether they are ‘used’ of God or not – then you must not have anything to do with them, and others should publically refute them or rebuke them as the Bible instructs in Titus and many other books.
If you want to demonstrate that the Copelands did not really say the things attributed to them, (proven by annotated tape recordings and written documents), then please say what and where and I will remedy it immediately if you are proven right. I did not know any of these things when God first started speaking to me about Gloria Copeland. I thought she were just a ‘normal’ Christian albeit in the limelight. These things from their own mouths that I found out subsequentally more than witness against their errant and blasphemous theology and are ample testimony to the truth of what I speak. Or do you think the Copelands must have ‘good’ theology because you were ‘blessed’ by them even though it contradicts the word of God? Which is it?
Furthermore, if you want to demonstrate that any of the things in the prophecy are not true, then prove them or prove where I have erred scripturally or remain silent. There is enough evidence that God speaks the truth through this vision. If you want to insist these words are not true and God is a liar despite the evidence because you were ‘blessed’ by the Copelands ministry, you are an unspiritual and unprophetic fool.
You also are a vicious and vindictive liar – though you attempt to kid others on you mean well and are really prophetic and spiritual. You are not. Prophets do not lie and do not prophesy falsely as you have, they do not call black white or twist the truth. They also know what prophecy is and is not and know the word of God on the matters we have discussed!
Admit it, the Holy Spirit did not show you any such thing, but your own evil heart did in order to exhort and further your own agenda!
I knew yet again you would be back despite what you claimed. You do not love truth very much in either your theology or what you practice, your duplicity has illustrated very helpfully what I have said about people who do not love the truth running after false teachers who will tickle their ears (such as the Copelands).
You are deceived and live in deceit among people who practice deceit with deceitful teachings and deceitful anointings, and so deceit has become so engrained in you that black has become white with a sanctified Christian label on, and you become a deceiver and you do not know what truth is anymore as your conscience is corrupted. Thanks for demonstrating this so well for others on this site.
You lie about your wrongful motives for leaving an alias even after being found out! I know full well what they were, so do you, so why lie and continue to lie? God has shown me exactly what and who you are HisOwn, dare you lie to the Spirit of God and say it is not true? Do you not fear God and the truth? Do you dare mock God and his servant?
You and I both know full well you do not genuinely ‘love me’ or ‘bless me’ and are being hypocritical. You know you pretend much.
You even dare to claim the Holy Spirit told you to come back and rebuke me and call me the things you have, yet I know full well you had full intention of being back even when you wrote your last post so coming back was not divinely inspired and you have lied on two points just there. I also know other things you plan to do in the future. I ask again, do you really think God is stupid? Do you really think that you can lie against the Spirit of God and get away with it? Perhaps you only consider it a ‘white’ lie and you have a higher purpose in protecting the Copelands? Yet you are blind and slander not only one of God’s servants but His own Holy Spirit. Realise the seriousness of grieveousness of what you have done, whatever your motives or ‘heart’!
I know what you say and speak is not the truth and know God told you no such thing about me, I know your heart and your motives and that you did not enquire of God as you claim you did and hear whay you say you did. But even if you did do as you claim, you say you heard from the Holy Spirit but the spirit you heard from is Satan as it is lies you tell, and the Holy Spirit only points to truth, proving my point about the true spirit and anointing on Copeland’s present ministry affecting you – Satan. Either which way you are shown to be in deceit and a liar.
Now I have already warned you of what it means to lie to people and God, and also against the Holy Spirit and I warn you most strongly of this once again because it is grievous what you are doing. Aninias and Saphira were not given multiple chances, they only were given one. The people who taunted Elisha were not given more than one chance either. You are fortunate you have not been judged immediately for your arrogance and sin. Who knows how long God will tolerate your mockery of Him and his servant. You are under judgment NOW, who knows its full consequences or force if you do not repent, perhaps it is too late to divert judgment but call on him nonetheless for I hope you will repent and God will be compassionate to you.
Examine your heart and mind, examine your beliefs and get right with God and fear Him and live in the truth and the light. Stop listening to lies and spreading them, and stop being a mouthpiece of Satan. Repent and do it hastily for you have already been given far more time and grace than better men or women have before you. FEAR GOD AND WHAT HE CAN DO. I hope you will repent and God will be compassionate to you and you will become a blessed beacon of light and a mouthpiece for truth and rightousness. But if you don’t repent, assuredly God will not be mocked. You risk his judgment for you sin intentionally and have no fear of Him and put him to the test.
To HisOwn
The facts i put in my last post actually come from KCM itself it doesnt take much researching to find…ive seen enough true light to not be blinded by the evil of such false ministries. i pray to God that you also may find the true light
I am very sad about what I have just read on this post. God is nothing but love, research it and you will find out. This is the message He wants delivered in these end times but it seems no one is listening. I have been searching for people who are hearing this message lately, but all I have found all over the internet is prophetic contradiction and people tearing each other down. We are to love God with all our hearts, soul, mind.. with all our strength, and to love our neighbor as ourselves, there is no other commandment greater than this. I don’t see this here or for that matter in 99 percent of the christian church.
This is a perilous time we live in and we cannot waste our precious time tearing people down. There are people in error every where. It does not matter if you are conservative, pentecostal, charismatic or whatever label you want to call someone. God is judging His people who are doing wrong, instead of us tearing these people down we need to lift them up in prayer, if they do not repent, it is between them and God. In this perilous time everyone needs to have a very close relationship with God and listen to Him, NOT to everyone who claims to have a word for the day.
During my search lately for I guess confirmation on what God is telling me, God has been telling me to quit searching and listening to all these voices. All I need is to listen to Him. I said Ok… but, sometimes I get curious and look anyway. After the other day when I was reading all the contradictions all these prophets are writing God spoke to me and He was very angry, He is tired of all these prophets speaking in pride and bringing words whether from Him or not in spiritual pride, wanting to make themselves look important. I said He will spit them all out of His mouth. He told me some prophets get some of His message right and twist it according to their beliefs, some are not prophets and some are right on but it was to keep to themselves for a confirmation or to give the word at a set time but they blab it all over to make themselves look important.
He told me not to read anymore of these internet prophecies that contradict and just read His word and listen to Him only. So I am going to do what He says. Please everyone!!! Listen to God, He wants His message of love to go out all over this world, He wants everyone saved!!!
Think about this… if an unsaved soul read through this post they would think God is nothing but confusion and hate.
God is love and the love you have is from Him, ask Him to give you the love He has for people and He will give it to you, be ready for something incredible for it will change your life and the way you view things.
You have someone who teaches you the truth and you need to listen to Him, not man.
Read 1 John over and over and over till you get the message.
With the love that God gave me,
Kevin
Kevin: you do not know the Bible well and read it blinded by bad doctrine. While God is undeniably love, your version of love and his are differant. Is it loving or not to yell to the child ‘get your hand out of the fire, it is hot and will burn you?’ This is not tearing the child down, but tearing their behavior and attitudes as well as sin down, revealing attitudes for what they are and calling a spade a spade. And what of the adult who encourages the child to get burnt deliberately for greed, or other motives – what would you or God ‘lovingly’ say to them?
With your current mindset, you’d rebuke Jesus, Paul and many others for what they did, and shout them down for being unloving – or have you forgotten that part of the Bible? How loving of it was it for Aninias and Saphira to be judged by instant death for lying to the Holy Spirit by your standards? But it was of God and a sign and wonder.
You are preaching a complacency and a watered down gospel of compromise. While it does not matter the label, it does matter the doctrine – and it is not just about being between ‘them and God’, the church has a responsibility to refute error and teach truth, and the watchman also has a responsibility to yell out when heretics, deceivers and wolves come along or the people’s blood is on their hands. Those who mock God and blaspheme against the spirit also need to be warned of what they do, that they are under God’s judgment.
You are reading the wrong prophets then, eh, to make these claims? The false ones as God does not contradict himself. The Holy Spirit apparently crucially ‘forgot’ to mention to you (indicating as well as you not knowing the Bible well, or many if any true prophets, you do not really hear from God well if at all) the prophet who does get it right and does not twist it for their own agenda, delivers it at the right time to the right people, does not blab for self importancy and is a faithful one who only seeks to obey God and honor and glorify him and knows the end result will probably be presecution not adoration. These people are rare, and the least popular because people like you shout them down, but there are some out there.
I suggest you read I John a bit better yourself, note particularly the bit about testing the spirits and the amount of deception in the world….But let’s all just love each other yeah, agree to disagree – cue enter the antichrist.
Read your Bible a bit better, Kevin and listen to God (testing what you think you ‘hear’ against the Bible) instead of to heretics and bad doctrine. Love does not lead to hell, but your path does…. Listen to what God himself says about me, my motives and what I say before shouting me down or accusing me of anything. See what love is and is not before accusing any of not loving. This is not just the loving thing to do, but the wise one.
End Times Prophet, I was not judging your prophecy, that was not my focus in this post. It was the slanderous postings on both sides, defending each others belief. You do not need to keep defending yourself on this prophecy, If you are right it does not matter who writes against you. Let it go… you delivered your message.
Kevin: you not only judged ‘my’ prophecy, but you also judged me, my motives and intentions in saying what I said about the Copelands and also about ‘His Own’. In defending your bad beliefs and doctrine you slandered me and the Holy Spirit by calling us ‘unloving’. You also said I ’slander’. I do not, I state the truth, do you not realise it was by prophecy and the Spirit of God I called out ‘His Own’ and know what I do about them and rebuked their lying and hypocrisy? I do not need to defend anything – God’s word stands or falls based on truth – but I respond to these comments that some who are open to truth may learn and that others will be rebuked where necessary.
This two-ing and fro-ing regarding who is right and who is wrong is totally pointless and detaching itself from the original context of this site,s intention the way i read this site is that it is sending a warning from god to open the eyes of the many false prophets(Copelands, Hinn,Myers,TBN,etc) that bombard the mind and senses of many honest christians.
It is intended as information so that they may see the true light and not be led asunder by these hideous false prophets coming to you as wolves in sheeps clothing.
The scandals of the Bakers back in the 80,s should have been the “awakening” that we all needed to hear and see… and soon God himself will step in and end the reign of these people who choose to server Satan rather than Him.
Their greed and selfish ways in the eyes of God will be terminated so that his light may shine and lead you on his path… God will publicly humiliate these charlatans and expose them as what they are for all to see.
God be with you
The grip grows tighter surrounding Kenneth and Gloria Copeland more people are becoming aware of their evil ways and as such more people are exposing them as what they truly are(greedy/money hungry people)ultimately if they are to be punished for their sins against Gods children it needs to be Now and not once they have past from this earth.. as their children are being groomed and prepared to take over the family business..Both Kenneth and Gloria are elderly people now and will soon vanish from public display..but to stop it from being continued by their offspring.. i pray to God to publicly expose and humiliate these charlatans before they vanish.
From … http://www.ondoctrine.com/10copela.htm
Kenneth Copeland is a wise-cracking, smart-aleck talking individual who presumes to speak for God and actually tell God what to do in his life. His god actually speaks with the same perverted English phraseology that he uses himself. Does it not matter that the perverted use of the English language by Kenneth Copeland is an offense to his listeners and to ascribe its use by God through His revelations is an affront and insult to Him?
With all the power that Kenneth Copeland claims to have, why doesn’t he create his own money instead of begging from other people? Why doesn’t he create food for all of the starving people of the world? Why doesn’t he go into the hospitals of the world and heal those who are sick? Why doesn’t he replace missing arms, legs and restore faces mutilated by fire and accidents? Why doesn’t he move mountains and perform other miracles that he claims believers can do if they just follow his teachings? If these powers are available and the Bible teaches about them, why haven’t other Christians since the time of Christ been able to do the things that he claims are within the domain of the believer? Kenneth Copeland has been teaching for over 30 years – how long does it take to acquire and learn the use of these powers? If the teacher cannot accomplish what he teaches, how are his students expected to be successful? If Kenneth Copeland’s claim of power is real, why hasn’t the world been beating a path to his door in order to find out how to obtain the power for its benefit?
From… http://obadiah1317.wordpress.com/category/prosperity-gospel/
Joyce Meyer, Juanita Bynum, Paula White, Gloria Copeland, Cindy Jacobs, Patricia King and many others are missing it. If I did not know who they were and were to meet them face to face I would probably like these women. They are strong and have courage, gumption and charisma, admirable qualities if used for the purposes of God.
That being said, I believe that the Lord has shown me something about these Power and or Prosperity Goddesses in the so-called church today; they are like “Delilah”, they are for sale and hired and paid by the Philistine Lords.
I refer to them as Goddesses because others worship them, not because they say they want to be worshipped, but they allow it and it puffs them up. My point is that these women would not be where they are today without powerful with money MEN exalting them. It is men who own the TV stations and promotion companies, hotels, convention centers and so on.
These men are behind the curtain of the Wizard of Oz and are true puppet-masters and use these women to raise money. These women may be in front of the cameras but I would venture to say that their boards of beneficiaries are all if not mostly men. Who owns TBN, DayStar, PTL, God TV and so on? Some like Kenneth Copeland offer a Healing School that you can pay to attend. PAY to be given the power of the Lord to heal? It is revolting, and makes me ill!
These men and women bind up the Church with Idolatry causing the congregation to desire and seek Power, Prosperity and Healing Powers and not the Lord. We are to seek the Lord and Peace and pursue it not the blessings. Blessings come upon and overtake the Believer! Righteousness, obedience and seeking the Lord causes the blessings to roll in. If you pursue the STUFF and not the Lord you may get the Stuff but it is not coming from the Lord.
So many of these men either never had or no longer have a Church Buildings with congregations. Why is that? Why do they have the need and desire to run to and fro and travel from convention to convention raising money with no accountability, and NO FRUIT to maturity?
These MEN are the Lords of the Philistines in my opinion. They have and continue to use flamboyant tactics and now resort to robbing the Church of its strength and making it blind using the women to seduce as well. Why use the women? Women appear gentler, softer, less threatening by nature so people let their guards down a lot easier and men capitalize on that. Consider this: Sampson & Delilah is a scriptural account, a type and shadow of the church today, IF THIS DOES NOT WORK TO GET THEIR MONEY LETS TRY THAT. The Men and Women of God need to take a stand and the men lead the way and bring down the pillars of the house where the Lords of the Philistines are standing the Idols in the Church.
Judges 16:4 After this it came about that he loved a woman in the valley of Sorek, whose name was Delilah. 5. The Lords of the Philistines came up to her and said to her, “Entice him, and see where his great strength lies and how we may overpower him that we may bind him to afflict him. Then we will each give you eleven hundred pieces of silver.” 6. So Delilah said to Samson, “Please tell me where your great strength is and how you may be bound to afflict you.”
I just read this passage from another site and was really amazed to think that these Female pulpit pimps are being seen somehow in a sexual way of attracting audiences to their meetings…
In 1 Kings 16:31 and following we are introduced to King Ahab and his wife Jezebel. Jezebel was the daughter of Ethbaal II who was king of the Sidonians. When she came into power, her husband had made an altar to Baal and worshipped that false god. The allusion in Revelation 2:20 to the Jezebel of Israel tells us that they were permitting an unsaved woman to teach and that teaching had seduced many in that church. The word “seduced” carries with it the meaning of “lead astray, delude, or mislead.” Whatever this woman was teaching was misleading the Christians to commit spiritual fornication and maybe sexual fornication too. Whatever her teachings were, they were definitely of a false religion and had no business inside of the church. She was also in violation of God’s rules about women teaching in a church. (1 Tim 2:11-12 KJV) Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. {12} But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. We see the same thing in modern churches where women are now teaching in churches and even large crowds. Women like Joyce Meyer, Marilyn Hickey, Gloria Copeland and others in the charismatic movement are teaching and leading people astray with their emotion and prosperity based gospels. These would not exist if men would not attend their meetings in droves. (Isa 3:12 KJV) As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths. The problem in Thyatira was the church was permitting this woman to teach and obviously no one had opposed her teachings.
(Rev 2:21 KJV)
And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
The word “space” carries with it the meaning of “time.” The Lord had given this woman time to repent of her pernicious teachings. The word “fornication” is the Greek word “porneia” where we get the English word “pornography.” However, with all false teachers they refuse to repent of their evil teachings as was the case with this woman. The church could have stopped her but they did not. She was probably titillating the flesh of her hearers with her false teaching. The word titillate carries with it the meaning of “to stimulate by means of tickling.” (2 Tim 4:3 KJV) For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; False teachers always speak with authority and this is how they always gain a following.
(Rev 2:22 KJV)
Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
…………………………………………………
someone please tell me if i am reading this correctly??Are these women being used as “eye candy” to attract male,s to these meetings?? if so i must have an odd sense of attractive as i dont find any of them good looking neither physically nor spiritually…
joh11:
There is very much a culture of needing to look the part on TBN etc, as ‘eye candy’ – and there are gospel whores who look beautiful who are pimped for wrong self centred purposes – but these gospel whores are of BOTH sexes, male and female. The church is referred to as a ’she’, as also is the adulterous church referred to as a ’she’, it is this ’she’ NOT womenkind that the Bible speaks against when talking about Jezebel, it is the false teachings not the fact the teacher was a woman. These people you have mentioned lead astray not because they are women, but because they do not love the truth and are greedy and selfish and ear ticklers which are sins prevalent in both sexes. Many more men than women preach heresy!
Women can teach and have spiritual authority, there is a post on it here….
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/2007/09/30/women-in-ministry-and-female-spiritual-authority/
I think its time something was done about these hideous people who choose to serve satan rather than god…. Kenneth and gloria Copeland need to be brought before the lord and exposed as the frauds they are for all the world to see
Some very interesting reading and expose of the truth… http://www.intotruth.org/wof/mytest.html
from: http://www.gibbsmagazine.com/Gospel%20of%20Wealth%20a%20Ponzi%20Scheme.htm
The Gospel of Wealth is a Ponzi Scheme many use to get rich and harm Christians by giving them the promise of wealth. While the con artists preachers have the people’s money as their actual wealth, the people have the promise of the scam artist. The preachers of wealth blend flawed Bible reasoning, which is their alchemy, and they take a mixture of Old Testament scriptures and some New Testament scriptures and blend them into a potion that says, God’s people should be the head and not the tail of the money pool. And the way that is done is by paying tithes and giving offering to them and God will do the rest in returning money to the giver. They claim a tenth of any money the poor believer receives as sacrifice to God that must be sent to them. Hence, they are God in this instance. Of course, they claim only to be a servant of God to receive his money.
I have only read a couple of your prophecies, so I will not make an overall sweeping statment, but so far, what you have seen and said checks with my spirit. The only thing I would suggest to you is that you not defend the words the Lord has given you. When people comment back to you and are in disagreement or want to judge you and the words of the Lord, don’t defend them. Let the words(or the Lord) speak for Himself. Let truth be challenged, but not defended.
The more I read these comments from people defending the so-called false prophets and teachers and ministries and from folks condemning the material on this Web site, the more I have to wonder WHY PEOPLE AREN’T READING THEIR BIBLES!!!!
That’s all it takes really to learn the truth. JUST OPEN YOUR BIBLE, ASK GOD TO GUIDE YOU IN YOUR READINGS… AND START READING. Read little by litte. Read one verse and ponder it. If you don’t understand a word or phrase, look it up. That’s the beauty of the Internet (it’s not just for evil, folks) — you can compare translations of the Word in just a few simple key strokes.
Stop being so quick to defend — or condem — someone or their teachings. Arm yourself first. Don’t regurgitate some stripped down verses you heard somone else say. Know the truth for yourself. Stop being lazy and depending on others to tell you what to think and believe or to tell you what’s acceptable or what GOD wants from you in your life. IT’S IN THE BIBLE! READ IT! I can’t say it enough: READ YOUR BIBLE READ YOUR BIBLE READ YOUR BIBLE. Only when you read and understand will you be able to see clearly.
If a person who subscribes to atheism or agnostcism or any non-’Christian’ belief (just a regular Joe, let’s say, who grew up in the Amazonian rain forest and never saw a Bible, heard about Jesus, or even knows what a pair of Nikes are) can hear someone who calls themself a Christian, like Kenneth Copeland (easiest example), say something like GOD isn’t allowed on Earth or that you should pray to yourself (he said it, look it up, lazy bones) and know something is just a tad bit off with what this person is saying or how they’re ‘intepreting’ the Bible, then why can’t you, the ones who cling (not-so-blindly, by the way) to these sinful and disgusting false prophets and teachers and ministers obey the LORD and flee from them? You think you can keep hoping that they’re right, when you know darn well that they’re wrong? GOD isn’t a gimmick, folks. GOD is not a money machine. People who never even call on his name live fine and dandy carefree lives (as for their soul, how knows), so what makes you think you can ’sew’ some money and that GOD’s just gonna start churning out ‘miracles’ and ‘blessings’ in your life? GOD DOESN’T NEED YOUR PAPER MONEY. Kenneth Copeland does for his new jet and new house and new investments. Your money can’t buy salvation or blessings. Live a clean life, a life dedicated to GOD. Put him first, not your material needs and wants. Haven’t you read it (probably not, lazy bones)? — The number of the hairs on your head are numbered, why wouldn’t GOD provide you with all that you need (what you may want’s a different story)? The hairs on your head, folks. That’s how worthy and important you are to GOD. So stop listening to this bunk about sewing some seeds so that the funnel gates and windows of heaven will be opened and that blessings will fall on you. Tithe. Show GOD that you appreciate what HE HAS ALREADY DONE. And if he keeps taking care of you (of course he will), keep tithing. That’s the only reason why you have somthing to give in the first place — cause he gave it to you. See that? It belongs to him anyway.
As I was saying…
What makes you all defend those vipers so passionately and strike out so blindly at those who wish to merely show you the light? Buy a concordance if you have trouble finding the appropriate passage in the Holy Bible. But believe me, it’s there. Though shall not make my Father’s house a den of theives. Love the Lord they GOD with all they heart. The love of money is the root of all evil. It is easier for a camel to enter through the eye of a needle than it is for rich man to enter heaven. Not all that say Lord, Lord shall enter into heaven. The devil is a liar. There are many wolves in sheep clothing among you. One cannot have two masters… READ YOUR BIBLE.
Nicely said haroldmaude … bravo
See
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/2007/11/06/senate-panel-probes-6-top-televangelists/
Lets hope this “investigation” is real and not just a quick browse at the surface… it needs to go deep to get to the truth..and lets hope this Senator isnt open to bribes from these charlatans…maybe instead of the black garbage bag we might yet see good ole Gloria in orange prison garb..(ill bet that doesnt come in designer labels
From: http://www.thestar.com/News/article/274162
By the looks of this quote from this site i would say Orange is definately looking like Glorias next choice of outfit colour .
– Kenneth and Gloria Copeland of Kenneth Copeland Ministries of Newark, Texas, a $20 million organization and prosperity gospel pioneer. Questions were raised about the transfer of church assets to a for-profit company, Security Patrol Inc., a $1 million loan from Gloria Copeland to the group, and a “personal gift” of more than $2 million given to Kenneth Copeland to mark the ministry’s 40th anniversary.
A Copeland spokeswoman released a statement saying the ministry is working on a response to Grassley’s letter, follows all laws and best practices governing churches and religious nonprofit groups, and “will continue to do so.”
I find it funny everyone wants to be a prophet these days…everyone is hearing from the Lord concerning others yet can not hear a word of the Lord from himself. This prophecy of the copeland is GARBAGE…i noticed you seek the Lord about other people why dont you mind your business and seek the Lord regarding yourself. You obviously are some storefront church or cyberprofit that has no calling. You need to head back to the School of the Word and get some understanding. You are a novice talking out the side of your neck Sit down and get taught. IF YOU HAVE TO TELL SOMEONE YOUR A PROPHET…MAYBE YOUR NOT THE PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING. True prophets never advertise themselves.
and yet more…. http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/localnews/news8/stories/wfaa071107_mo_prayerrequests.1eb51b6a4.html
Oh no it seems that poor ole Ken and Gloria just cant get it right here in this article it explains how … and wait for it?????? Ken and Gloria are FAR to busy to pray over Prayer request from their”partners” but have plenty of time to go shoot some of gods creatures.. or go skiing down slopes?? or sunbaking on some tropical island beach????? these people are an abomination they are charlatans of the worst kind and Deserve the full wrath of Gods anger….
The “letter” Senator Grassley sent to the Copelands… http://grassley.senate.gov/public/releases/2007/110620076.pdf
Joh: thanks for the links. This is the article from one of the links: http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/localnews/news8/stories/wfaa071107_mo_prayerrequests.1eb51b6a4.html
One day after the announcement of a congressional investigation into their ministry finances, televangelists Kenneth and Gloria Copeland of Fort Worth may have a new set of problems.
Revelations have arisen from former ministry insiders that say Copeland’s faithful followers are being misled and that it’s time for the truth to come out.
It was News 8 that first reported on the private use of the Copeland ministry’s $20 million jet, trips made to a ski resort and exotic game hunting ranch.
But the real turbulence for Copeland’s ministry may come from within the security gates of his Eagle Mountain Church and Ministry Headquarters that are north of Fort Worth.
Former employees told News 8 that the Copelands one sees on television are not the same Copelands in real life.
Four former Copeland ministry employees said they are disappointed by the discovery of what they said really goes on inside ministry operations.
Among those who have come forward is Jeff Spradlin, who said he grew up admiring the Copelands and was excited to get a job working for them.
“Within 90 days, I started realizing this was a huge mistake,” he said.
For nearly two years, Spradlin said he worked in the mail processing center where prayer request envelopes stuffed with cash would arrive every morning. He said a group of ministers, not the Copelands, would pray over the unopened envelopes.
But Spradlin said he and other mail processors were the only ones who actually read the requests.
“I was sitting there getting this paperwork all the day thinking, Kenneth and Gloria don’t see a word of this,” he said.
Another former mailroom worker, who asked to remain anonymous, said, “none of the prayer requests I handled were ever seen by Kenneth or Gloria Copeland.”
The same worker said mail processors would send return letters to Prayer Partners, which was crafted to give the look of a personal response. In fact, the ministry recently bought a new high tech printer, which according to the manufacturer, gives Copeland “a finished document that looks 100 percent personalized.”
“They think that when they get the letter back that someone has actually prayed,” said Nathan Boutwell, another person who has worked with the ministry. “That’s very misleading.”
Boutwell also said it was he, not Copeland, that read the prison ministry prayer requests.
“There was no actual human contact with that letter besides my eyes,” he said. “But that’s ok, Copeland gets 10,000 letters a week. But admit that. Don’t imply that you read these personally when you don’t.”
The former employees News 8 spoke to also said their spirits sank after learning the Copelands have little if any contact with their Prayer Partners and their staff.
“The one time I saw the man was at the Christmas party,” Boutwell said.
According to another former employee, Barbara Pierce, workers were told to avoid the Copelands if they ever encountered them.
“It was an unwritten law that if Kenneth or Gloria walked into the office you don’t see them, you don’t speak to them,” she said.
Former employees also said when the Copelands weren’t on the road, they spent their days inside their 18,000 square foot parsonage on the shores of Eagle Mountain Lake, surrounded by hundreds of acres of range and ranch land, which was not far from their tennis courts and boat house.
While Copeland told News 8 he does pray over some of his requests, he said he doesn’t over all of them due to the volume of mail he gets every day. He said he has a prayer team pray over the requests when he can’t.
Copeland said he has little contact with his staff because he and Gloria are private people who are on the road preaching much of the time. He also took News 8 to task for continually criticizing his ministry.
“You don’t want to talk about the productive side of the ministry, you just want to run me down,” he said. “You want to tear down everything you can and I don’t understand that.”
What side of the cross are you living? Last time I looked judgement was dealt with on the cross once and for all! Even if there is a glimpse of truth to what you say God would not seek someone like you that is living in judgement to bring His people to correction. It is His love that brings us to repentance. Prophecy is to edify and bring people into a different dimension in God. It is to draw us to the Father. Your kind of prophecy tears down and devalues people. You have some kind of personal vendetta that comes out of a embittered heart. I had someone give me one of your kind of prophetic words and it was a word for him and he went through exaltly what he spoke. He went through his own personal sifting and it was hell on earth for him. I did nothing and I said nothing asgainst this man. God is a GOOD God. He does not demean His People!!! And He expects His people to have the same heart. This is the first time I have even visited this website and I guarantee this will be the last!!!
Sheila: you very obviously do not love truth, the Bible or God. What a shame.
To Sheila Exposing frauds and con men fleecing Gods Children is hardly “bitter” nor a vendetta its more in keeping with what the bible has said about exposing the false prophets… in this case those hideous fraud Televangelists who sell the word of God for their own selfish greedy needs whilst the poor sheep(mostly aged or infirmed) go to their meetings hoping for a miracle to happen only to be insulted with garbage like” if you dont SOW into gods kingdom then you are doing wrong by God( in this case The Sowing is giving more to these greedy charlatans to support their horribly extravagant lifestyle….i suggest that this site is not about hate or anger… rather its about making people wake up and be aware of this fraud that exists.
Just to backup what is written here as the “truth”
look here… http://theworldfrommywindow.blogspot.com/2007/11/7-lessons-pastors-can-learn-from-senate.html
In honor of Senator Grassley’s investigation of six prominent televangelists … Pastors, I plead with you–for the sake of the Gospel and God’s glory, take heart.
Lesson #7: No pastor, church, televangelist, or pope supersedes human authority. Romans 13:1 (ESV), “Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.”
Lesson #6: Accountability isn’t a bad thing. As pastors and church leaders, we are not above the rule of law; and neither are we above accountability to our own congregations–or our own government. In fact, if we have nothing to hide, we should willingly embrace accountability. Romans 13:2-3 (ESV), “Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad.”
Lesson #5: God has ordained human governments to work for the good of society (and even the good of the church). Human governments are God’s idea. They are not to be feared because the governmental ruler “is God’s servant for your good” (Romans 13:4). Even evil governments have resulted in the good of the church (see China and the rapidly growing church amid communistic rule).
Lesson #4: Lavish lifestyles are a detriment to the Gospel. If you want to see what prosperity does to people, I recommend a brush-up on the Rich Young Ruler (Matthew 19:16-22).
John Copelands response to the inquiry by Sen Grassley… http://www.kcm.org/john_copeland.php
By the sounds of this response i would say hes going to refuse to give any details to Sen Grassley
Would you praise the Jehova`s Witnesses for provoking in me an enormous zeal to scrutinize the bible ? I have to admit, the JW blessed me abundantly, but I never was tempted to give any credit to them. Gloria Copeland can as well be a blessing to somebody (as well as donkeys can) but this does absolutely not proof her as a genuine follower of Christ. How can we discern truth from lies ? who is a false prophet ? THe prophet who heard from God, never says a single false word. Have you ever heard the copelands prophesying ? Has every single word turned out to be true ?Scripture says, there will be many false ones, but does not even mention there will be more or less correct prophets. For that reason I tend to believe none if not the Spirit in me reveals the same truth to me personally. If my husband confirms to me having been revealed the same, we go along with scripture demanding two or three witnesses. So I dare witness publicly that Gloria Copeland is deliberately misleading and deceiving . God hates sinners and there is no reason to pretend love for satan`s agent and asking for intercession on her behalf. As my Lord Jesus Christ never spoke in polite and flattering manners to his enemies, I do not either.
arabella: I would never praise the Jehovah’s Witnesses for anything. It is a false religion, if God used them despite this (as your donkeys) then all glory to God but never to the evil Watchtower organisation!
etpw:JW was not my point. To get me right, I see no difference between JW , Evangelicals, Pentecostals, Methodists, Catholics and all the other 36900 denominations.
pinions) will not inherit the kingdoom. Since the temple has been destroyed, there is no more house of good, no more priests, no more tithes, offering and sacrifices.The kingdom has suffered violence from the beginning, that has not changed. Violated into an old testament cult in the name of Jesus, changing the sabbath into a sunday- must-not-miss-service. All those christians are calling upon Jesus, but they are still satan`s children.
Idolaters and heretics (if you know greek, it simply means
There is not much time left and the devil is hurrying counterfeiting the bride of christ. Church is spiritual based on the godgiven revelation who Jesus really is. On this rock, said Jesus, will I build my church. Furthermore he said: When you pray, do it in your private rooms ! I will built the church , said the Lord. There will be false Christs, each denomination seems to have its own.
Have you ever dared to speak about repentence in your “church”, have you ever dared to question your pastor or any of their idolized doctrins? They usually get very annoyed or the opposite they pour syrupy love on you, do they? Reading several comments on your site, I saw the same manners. What is the purpose of you commenting the comments?
Preaching the gospel to the unsaved or casting pearls before swine? Satans children never accept a correction by me or you, they reject every scripture, we will never change the enemies camp by argueing or quoting the scriptures, they always find another verse to strenghten their opinion (i.e. heresy), do they? As long as somebody is not brokenhearted and brokenminded, he can not see the truth. The access to God is, was and will always be holiness. Holy becomes only a broken man, repenting from deep within , hungry and thirsty for righteousness and a zeal for sanctification, willing to humble himself extensively and sacrifice his ego to Jesus.
If a person is interested in comfort, blessings, spiritual-sensual experiences, wisdom or whatever motiv is bringing him into the christian temples, he will end up where he wanted to be, getting every distraction from his iniquity, enough satisfaction to search no more for the true god, if this was once his intention. We have to struggle a lot not to be deceived, even our own hearts are able to deceive us, probably more than all the false teachers, not to speak of demons, strongholds (opinions, sic!)…” go behind me satan” was addressed to Peter !Judas was an apostle, certainly “fully in office” till the devil entered him.
The lord told us how to pray : deliver us from evil. (US!)
Oh I find it sooooo sad that people out there are too blind to see the hypocrisy of these ministers. Millions of people watch these TV gospel programs and are conned into ‘PAYING for God’s healing and salvation’. HOW BLIND DO YOU HAVE TO BE TO NOT SEE THIS?
Since when do you have to PAY TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH JESUS?
People are in bondage, financial debt and spiritually broken because of these ministers! They play on the emotional side of human nature. Are you sick?? Give God $1000 right now and get HEALED! Are you in financial trouble? Give God the little you have left and you will be rewarded a 100 fold! Do it!!! Do it!!! Do it!!! Take out a LOAN!!! It’s for GOD!!!!
WHAT UTTER BLASPHEMY!!!!!
AND YOU QUESTION THE PERSON THAT IS TRYING TO EXPOSE THIS EVIL? WHAT ON EARTH IS THIS WORLD COMING TOO!!!!
Oh I know! I know all too well… It’s the way the world is going…when you can’t question what is wrong or right anymore. Please don’t question these special people because they are Godly. They might have been once upon a time, but right now…IT’S CLEARLY NOT THE CASE!
Those who oppose get labeled; judgmental, condemning, self-righteous etc. Label me any day, I don’t care one bit. I WILL STAND UP FOR THE WORD OF GOD AT ALL TIMES (not the word of PEOPLE).
You say these people are anointed? Says who? Who the heck says they are Christian to begin with? I know several people who call themselves Christian and don’t even know who Jesus really is! I even came face to face with a TRUE con-artist who knew the bible inside out and back to front and called himself a Christian only to con people out of their money – this believe it or not was his profession. The POINT IS, just because someone says they are something does not mean they are!!!
The ONLY TEST IS THE WORD OF GOD and AGAIN WHAT THESE PEOPLE PREACH IS NOT THE TRUE WORD OF GOD, but a TWISTED con to make themselves richer and destory souls!
Yes there will be people that will come to know Jesus through all this rubbish – all be it a distorted view. But what about the countless faceless people out there who are searching for truth and land up getting HALF OF IT and are RUINED because of it!!!
You talk about those who oppose this heresy as being angry against fellow Christians?? WHAT ON EARTH!!! I have never heard such nonsense in my life!!!! WE LOVE!!! We care enough to go out there and TELL THE TRUTH so that people can see what is going on and be set free from these false teachings. My heart cries when I hear what these ministers preach and my heart cries even more for the countless numbers that fall for it.
I just can’t believe that people can be so blind and allow these people to get away with it. Makes me wonder who they worship more; the minister or God!
I have prayed about this as well as ’sat’ on it for a few days and am convinced this is for public view. I have already notified KCM ministries in Fort Worth of this prophecy’s existence and given them a link to it.
(I had not seen Gloria before this but I knew exactly what she looked like as has been subsequentally confirmed by an internet search. I was very surprised to hear God speak her name to me: it came out of ‘nowhere’ as I have not heard her name or thought about her for a long time.)
(An ‘apologetic’: I did not know anything about Gloria Copeland before this vision apart from I knew her name and the fact she was a Pentecostal on Christian TV now and again. I certainly did not think her to be all that ‘bad’ doctrinally, or otherwise, (but then I did not really know anything about her as I had never researched her). I wish to emphasise there was no prejudice toward her on my part before this vision.
I find it interesting that so many people are calling you to task for simply stating what you believe the Holy Spirit showed you and told you. You have made the following statements that I quoted above in this response which I think showed that you made a true effort to make sure you were in a right place, that you did attempt to contact the Copeland Ministry, and that you really didn’t know anything about Gloria Copeland until this “revelation” came forth.
I commend you for this.
I also find it interesting how many who support these ministries and feel that these people “who are above reproach” are always “Gods anointed” and are “not to be touched. But then when one is under a strong delusion, they of course will not believe what the many other researchers who have spent many, many, hours of listening to, reading and documenting the false teachings that are out there in the church today.
Thank you for your obedience…By the way folks, Matthew 18 does not apply in this situation. Endtimespropheticwords according to the very words spoken above in this response shows that they “did not have any ought against the brother or sister” when the revelation came to them.
Reading this blog saddens me. It reads like a Christian civil war.
Love suffers long, having patience with imperfect people.
Love is kind, active in doing good.
love does not envy, since it is nonpossessive and noncompetitive. It actually wants other people to get ahead.
Love dos not parade itself. Love has a self-effacing quality; it is not ostentatious.
Love does not behave rudely, but displays good manners and courtesy.
Love does not seek its own, insisting on its own rights and demanding precedence; rather, it is unselfish.
Love is not provoked; it is not irritable or touchy, rough or hostile, but is graceful under pressure.
Love thinks no evil; it does not keep an account of wrongs done to it; instead, it erases resentments.
Love does not rejoice in iniquity, finding satisfaction in the shortcomings of others and spreading an evil report.
Love rejoices in the truth, aggressively advertising the good.
Love bears all things, defending and holding other people up.
Love believes the best about others, credits them with good intentions, and is not suspicious.
Love hopes all things, never giving up on people but affirming their future.
Love endures all things, persevering and remaining loyal to the end.
1 Corinthians 13:4-7 Quoted from Spirit Filled Bible.
I just stumbled upon this TV broadcast on YouTube about the Copland’s (I was actually looking for something else when I came across it). Anyhow it re-iterates EXACTLY what I said above.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D74VHiVLROM
Here is a video of Copeland saying that ‘Jesus was the first man to be born again’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIT8nKtgJtA&feature=related.
Now this is a classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watchv=JLOT9eOO8m4&feature=related.
But now for the finale, the video of all video’s. What Miriam quoted above is recorded on tape from Kenneth Copland’s mouth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3yDODIkf5I
You wanted proof, you got it. If you still can’t see the truth then all I can do is pray that one day you will.
Senior it cant be “christian” civil war when in fact these frauds “the Copelands” are not indeed Christians at all… moreso the exact opposite
Looks like you have a long-standing personal vendettathat has nothing to do with God. Very sad.
Joh11 In using the term ‘Christian civil war’ I wasn’t referring to the Copelands
A.Follower.. im not exactly sure where you are basing your assumption about a “personal vendetta” on as the way i see it its we are following Gods word and exposing these hideous false profits(The Copelands etc) who are not only robbing gods children but are also leading them astray with their false doctrines its sad you think otherwise… to be aware of such things is a good thing i would have thought??
oh and yes i intentially miss spelled :profits:
I agree with the view that the Copelands are seriously misguided.
God loves them, and any chastisement is for correction, not pre-fitting for the lake of fire.
Many evangelists today are just plain wrong! God isn’t like that! Many people are being deceived.
The reason I wrote this post is because I feel the Lord telling me also that their ministry is about to fall (and start a domino effect among the rest).
By the way, God already warned the Copelands long before he told me or anyone else about things to come there. But apparently they put God on hold.
That’s how its done: God speaks to the person in private (to the Copeland’s spirits). When they don’t listen, God gets another witness (God does exactly as He wants us to do when we have a problem with our brethren or sisters – He follows Scripture!).
Looks like the Copelands and Crefflo Dollar etc are going to challenge Senator Grassley,s investigation and let it be dealt out in the courts????? to me this makes no sense at all…. it basically means it will now become a VERY VERY public fight instead of keeping it hush hush like they wanted… kinda defeats their silly argument really doesnt it… crefflo is quoted as saying that as far as he is concerned Senator Grassley has no right to ask for such imformation…??? um unless im mising something here i would have thought the government can pretty much ask for anything… oh well i guess this saga is going to drag on in the court rooms…seems almost incredible that these people can profess to having nothing to hide but their doing their darnest to keep it hidden?? go figure
Latest News is that Kenneth and Gloria Copeland,and joyce meyer have relented on legal advice and have given “some” information to senator grassley,s office.. the rest crefflo dollar,benny hinn and paula white are still refusing to cooperate with the inquiry and have suggested it be taken to court….
Oh so Joyce Meyer is part and parcel with the Copelands? Interesting, I never knew that. Joyce Meyer often comes to South Africa and is hosted by Rhema Church. The billboard hoisted up with her face on was so big I wondered about everyone who was going to go there; were they going to worship Joyce or God.
A few years ago the minister at Rhema (a very very big church here in South Africa) divorced his wife and married another woman, who divoced her husband so they could be together. So many people in the church stood up for the minister and the board of the church voted to keep him on. I was horrified, but then I forgot that this is a business – can’t allow something like this to destory the business. Now his new wife sits in the church and acts like she is some kind of saint. Since then many overseas ‘annointed by God’ preachers have come to Rhema to preach, ignoring the hyporcisy and sin that has taken place. Why? Firstly, because we are just human, we all make mistakes and secondly Rhema has a 40,000 plus membership – that’s one big piggy bank just waiting to happen especially when you invite someone like Joyce Meyer over. Gosh, they must have made a killing.
thats what its all about Deborah unfortunately these kind of evil charlatans worship the almighty $$$$ rather than God…they prey on the weak and elderley in our society promising them healing and prosperity but at a price…they teach that you MUST sow into their “ministries” financially before you will prosper.. that is far from the teachings of christ… plus their doctrines are wayyyyy off track as far as the bible goes…. they are merely vultures picking at the bones of the innocent and as such deserve Gods wrath
See also
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/2007/12/13/a-vision-re-kenneth-copeland-of-kcm-ministries/
I really didn´t know that christians in US was so easy to be mislead. Those who know they have been born again and are lead by the Holy Spirit with an open heart to the Lord Jesus know that the Copelands are His true servants! We are indeed living in days when many christins – sorry to say but not always equal with being born by His Spirit – seems more directed by others judgements then led by His inner witness and His teaching to all His true children.
Charliedutten: any spirit that contradicts the Bible so blatantly, and acts in such a greedy way etc, is antichrist according to the Bible. So if your ‘Holy Spirit’ witnesses that the Copelands are true servants it is either a false spirit that speaks to you and is decieving you, or you are very naive and do not know how to discern, or you do not know how to hear God….or all of these. Certainly you do not know the Bible well. God cannot and does not contradict himself.
charliedutten,
Do you believe we as christians are all little gods running around the earth? Do you get drunk in the spirit?
New site dedicated to exposing televangelist fraud and false prophets… looks like it might be interesting once it gets going….. http://www.steves-space.info/televangelists-exposed-discussion-forums/index.php
i think that kenneth and gloria copeland must be doing something right to have all this attacks on them.satans goverment is even after them so that shows me that something is up.only time and jesus will tell who is right.
“i think that kenneth and gloria copeland must be doing something right” or perhaps something very very wrong Dennis???
WHO THE HELL ARE YOU ENDTIMES! JUST WHO THE HELL ARE YOU, OR DO YOU THINK THAT YOU ARE TO THINK THAT YOU SPEAK FOR THE LORD JESUS CHRIST IN SUCH AN ASSURED MANNER!!! I had read your “prophecy” about Gloria Copeland, and at 1st I started feeling, well, when the Lord has given me prohetic dreams and interpretations it has sounded similar to how it did with you. I mused over it for days……Could it have been of the Lord, what this person has put forth concerning Gloria Copeland? I BELIEVE NOW IT IS NOT! Yes, I believe con-artis need to be EXSPOSED! But after all I have been viewing on the internet and after mulling it over again and again in my heart and mind and asking God to show me….And after having a night time experience of my own….I DO NOT BELIEVE IT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT SPEAKING THROUGH YOU ENDTIMES! May the Lord Jesus Christ forgive me if it is, for the Spirit of God is no demon, but what I believe is that you HAVE A DEMON and he is working through you! I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT GLORIA SHARES KENNETH WITH ANOTHER WOMAN! I checked in my spirit and I really feel that you are just a person with a demon who “gets of” on being able to say “Thus saith the Lord!” You want to know why I feel that? Because He has used me before. And I know how awesome it feels to be used by God and to know things and have revealed knowledge, and to have every fiber of your being vibrate with the knowledge that Jesus is King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and God is real and on His throne, and the bible is for real and we as human beings have a perpouse on this earth and it does not just end when we die.
Excuse me EndTimes, are you babtised in the Holy Spirit? Do you speak with other tongues? For even the devil knows the word of God! Can you say that Jesus is your Lord and he came in the flesh, died in your place and rose from the dead?
I can hear what you are saying, that I must be a KCM supportor. Look at my blogs all over the internet! I have been grapling with what I have been hearing about them intensely and have even pretty much called them out on the carpet I have been so hurt over what I have read.
Like I said, I mulled over in my mind your “prophecy” for days and kept my mouth shut over it. But here is what I feel…….
If it where truely of the LORD, there would be NONE OF THIS BACK AND FORTH CONVERSATION WITH YOU TRYING TO JUSTIFY IT AND YOURSELF!!!!!!
If the Lord called me to upbraid the Copelands as you did, which I know He didn’t, I would just put out the prophecy and say……If this is truely of God He will bring His Words to pass and all that is hidden will be revealed in due time because He is King of Kings and Lord of Lord’s and HE will not be mocked by the Copelands or anybody!!! And if this “prophecy” is not of God….The words will fall to the ground and come to nothing!
But you, EndTimes feel you must defend it and yourself, though you say ….no I am defending God. LIAR! God does not need you to defend HIS words! They would bring themselves to pass you judus goat!
Who are you or me to Judge a man’s heart before the Lord?
Now if he and she has stumbled, or have truely been screwing people over on purpose the WHOLE TIME, and he and she did not just fall into greed or just not carring anymore…That is what God will bring into judgement and into light! Now would God use you in such a manner to bring things to light…..I think not, for like I said you spend an awfull lot of time defening yourself instead of saying just one thing, That if it’s of God it all comes out in the open and if it is not, these words will fall to the ground and I repent. SIMPLE END OF STORY!
But from what I see from your website….my my my endtimes, you really seem to feel you are an authority on every preacher and every faith and you seem to think you where set up by God to get out a whip and drive them all out of His house!
HOW DARE YOU!
THE LORD REBUKE YOU.
I have come to this conclusion….I Thank Kenneth and Gloria for encouragement I had gotten through the ministry. I honor them for the times that they actually spoke from the bible itself and it blessed me. Wether they are crooks, or just fell, or it just got out of hand is for the Lord to decide, not me. (My heart still goes out to the family of Bonnie Parker, I do not know why “The prayer of faith, shall save the sick” did not come to pass in their lives, but I know it did in mine, by standing on what the bible says, not neccessarily on what Ken or Gloria says)
Like I said, I am thankfull for and I honor the good that came to me through them, and I forgive and turn over to God whatever ways they may have been in the wrong! And that goes for all of the preachers!
Now if you listen to people like Alex Jones from infowars.com and prisonplanet.com, you can see a lot of evil is comming down the pike, and perhaps the mark of the beast in the form of an inplanted microchip. Maybe, the time for mega-churches is comming to a close because of the times we live in. We can not keep our eyes on any one “man of God.” We must turn-inward and hear the direction of the Holy Spirit. Because what if a “man of God” was on the mark for all these years in what he preached and then, after he had won all of your trusts, turned and said take the microchip, it is just the wave of the future and it’s ok, it is not 666! WE CAN NOT LOOK TO SPIRITUAL LEADERS OR POLITICAL LEADERS IN THIS TIME of which the bible spoke of when it said, “men’s hearts will fail them because of the fear of what is comming on the earth”. Do you think there won’t be men of God who tuck their tails and turn on you because they get bought off or scared!
Bottom line…Turn to Jesus and the Bible and look within yourselves where the Holy Spirit resides! He has the answers because men and women will fail you!
Please, ask Jesus to come into your heart today! You will never regret it!
These people are crooks. If the people who follow them would pray and read their bible, not just what’s spoon fed them, they would learn to discern and see what they’re doing. But since they’re so desperate for the money they’re promised, they don’t bother. Copeland and Eagle Mountain give them certain scriptures, while not giving them other scriptures on the same subject that doesn’t fit their agenda. I even saw George Pearsons read half of a long scripture (the promise part), and stop reading in the middle of it where the judgment part began. Copeland said at EMIC giving to the poor was not “good ground.” Good ground is the heart, not an investment place. They want to be sure the people give them the money, not other ministries or people who need help, and then they’ll get a jackpot (Copeland’s success will rub off on them). They don’t tell them God doesn’t even accept their offering when they’re in willful sin. They never mention sin. Only to believe and confess, and they’ll get it. What God’s will for that person is is never mentioned. (God only answers prayer if it’s in line with his will for that person’s life, no matter how much faith and confessing the person does). They make people think if it’s not working or bad things are happening to them, it’s their fault, contrary to Scripture (The Apostle Paul’s life after conversion, for example). This is so people won’t question when God doesn’t give them a jackpot back. Everything they do and say is to keep people excited about giving to them. I told a pastor at EMIC about a homeless woman I had gotten saved and wanted her to go to the church, and he said, “Street people have places to take care of them.” They didn’t want her at Eagle Mountain (She had no money to give to the church). They say to give with your motive being to get back. They make giving to God an investment, not from the heart, which will never work. God knows why they’re giving, no matter what they say. It’s only to get a jackpot back. They say, “God gave Jesus, expecting to get back.” Exactly. People, not money. They brag about their giving in church. Jesus said when you do that, you’ve already gotten your reward. I feel very sorry for the deceived followers of Copeland and his spin-off ministries. They’re desperate for money, and as a result they don’t bother to ask God and ask about other scriptures that would show them the truth. Nobody got money in the Bible when that was their goal. Solomon, for example. He was blessed because he asked for wisdom to be able to treat the People right, and not for himself (long life, the life of his enemies, and Wealth). When helping others is your goal in your heart, not just enriching yourselves, you’ll get back. With God, it’s all about the motives and intents of the person’s heart. But I’m sure some of his followers will not bother to check for themselves and they’ll denounce this, thinking that God is going to give them their jackpot for being loyal to “Brother” Copeland. Some Christians are just like the secular world. The world worships celebrities, and some Christians worship preachers instead of the Lord. No matter what they do, they say, “Oh, that’s a man of God.” Very, very sad.
Gary:
How dare he? I knew he was a quack but this is really disgraceful and blatant and it shocks me how any of the church will put up with it. So the poor, the widows and orphans etc are bad ground, and he is good ground?!!! What for this ’seed’ to be spent on gold plated taps and jet planes etc?!
If his prosperity gospel really worked, and it really was about the other folk’s welfare and not lining his own pockets, then she should seed her last 10 cents and watch it grow so she can have a mansion eventually too!
Next, she is not a ’street woman’. She is a woman on the street because of bad times. She does not belong to the street. She belongs in warmth and safety and it is the church’s responsibility to help her if she will have it.
And lastly, though people will not proclaim it so blatantly or admit it, many church’s have the same attitude about the ’street people’ not belonging among them. I guess they are right, the poor deserve much better!
Gary, may God bless you richly and use you to bring many more poor people to Christ.
‘But I am only poor, and I have only my dreams …. tread lightly, for you tread on my dreams.’
Dear Dawn Survivor:
please go here:
http://www.letusreason.org/Wf21.htm
and please go here:
http://www.letusreason.org/Wf22.htm
To GARY and ENDTIMES: I feel both of your last blogs where right on the money! I know all you say in that blog is true Gary. At 1st when I heard all that came out about KCM, I was furious! NOT about it comming out, but because if it is true, it is more than just a shame! It is bad on so many levels! But then I HEALED some and realized that even though not everything they’ve done is perfect in The Lord, some things to me where good. Like you said they where only one-sided. But for a person who only heard the bad side, like God is ANGRY, and hates women, and wants you poor and don’t care…….well to see that there IS A BLESSING SIDE, for them to have shown that is a GOOD THING, when so many people only know the bad side like you are nothing but a worm, and stuff like that. So I decided to honor whatever good did come out of them for me, and give them to God for HIM to deal with whatever bad comes from them. With EndTimes, maybe the 1st parts of her prophecy where right on the money and the part of adultery, well…..maybe like me, she feels “make a tree all good and it’s fruit all good or make it all suck so I don’t get confused” and the last part may be from only a gut feeling and not the Lord. I am not to judge Endtimes. I am sorry. But at the same time I am just tired of everyone believing that they are 100% right, because we are human and we can still miss it; and people can get slandered even worse than they may deserve to be. No, I am not a cool-aid drinker for KCM in any way, but I did receive some good and I try to not forget any kind of kindness that may have been shown me in a world where kindness is hard to find. I let God deal with the rest.
Gary, I remember in one of Kenneth’s sermons he said the smelly street people we are to save and bring them into the church and if you don’t like it because they are gross, you had better check your heart untill you have compasion enough for them to get down on your knees and wash their dirty feet for them! Not exact words but that is what he said! I being one who showers daily had a tough time with that one!!!! Big time! But I had to deal with it. Because I knew that statement was right. Maybe Ken just said that to make himself look good or was a different man years ago. You can’t serve God and money. If money has become his new God…..then I can see how they changed. But I will show thanks for the good and hand the rest over to God for taking care of the bad, and it took me weeks to get to this point. I know what you said is true Gary, I appreciate balance, not just one-sided-ness. But there was a time I needed to be exposed to the one side because all I saw was the “God’s gonna get you part”. And EndTimes, I don’t know you, sorry for jumping on you. But at the same time I do feel if it is of God, you never need to defend it….meaning, let people see for themselves how he brings what you said to the light. And because we are to be humble and we do not know 100% if we where all the way right, don’t push it. Say Lord I said what I felt you wanted of me to, I stuck my neck out and you take care of the rest, and if I was wrong, I am not pridefull, let my words fall to the ground. That is it!
But boy Gary the 1st hand account story you told…..well, I already knew I could no longer support KCM for about 6 reasons that come to mind. They NO LONGER fit the criteria for what I can back and support. And as far as ever having given them money…..Well, it was never a large amount, and it was never to be rich…..In my heart it was to tithe and to be RIGHT before the Lord, HONOR HIM in an act of Worship with my offering to God, not to KC. And I do know that KCM did bring water and supplys to Louisiana after the hurricane, while the government didn’t do a dam thing for 3 days!!!!! Well, accept for going into houses, even ones that where dry, with the military to take away everyones guns!! Wake up america! While we are acting like dogs bitting eachother, the enemy is sneeking up from behind perhaps in the form of a ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT and the PATRIOT ACT, and terrorism that they LET happen to scare us out of our own freedoms! Don’t act like well, we are christians and we don’t have to pay attention to all of that. That form of thinking is madness! What if the internet gets shut down and no more free speach to do what we are doing here, or making it a hate crime to tell others that they are going to hell if they don’t receive the one who died for them. God I believe will say to each of us….What have you done to promote good and defeat evil, and yes to clothe the naked and feed the poor. There is more to consider than our differences of opinion on how the word is interperated. Let us all get our priorities straight. I had to learn, let God deal with the preachers and even the prophets. If they are of HIM and their hearts are right before Him, he will straighten them out. We must lift up Jesus before all, and lift up our heads from the sand and let people know what is comming so we will not be taken un-aware!
Dawn Survivor: the words I speak prophetically will be proven for themselves as not being my own. I do not justify them, neither do I need to defend them. God is big enough. Like you say, they will stand and fall on their own merit in the fullness of time, but there is ample evidence ALREADY that what I say about these people is the truth.
However, that said, I do seek to teach people also on things and warn them – and if I can help clarify misunderstandings about what I say or whatever there is no harm in that. Not all people may understand my language or symbology and if I can help clarify things then that is OK. I am also entitled to have my own opinion on these things in addition to the ‘pure’ prophetic things I speak first. Indeed, some would consider these opinions (from me and others), part of the weighing and testing and understanding and application of a prophecy – but be that as it may, I do not apologise for making any comments here, nor do I apologise for ‘defending’ the truth. I am sorry you misunderstand my motives for posting comments though, and hope that you now perhaps understand me a little better, and understand why I comment as I do.
I welcome your imput and pray that God will lead you into all truth. If you ever discern anything, or are uncomfortable about it, please feel free to post your concern – however it may well be that what you ‘discern’ is out of misunderstanding that can be resolved in these comments rather than actual discernment. For instance, re you saying I should know Christ, have you not read my statement of faith and my other testimonies in other posts on this site?
Lastly, false teachers are not false about everything. There is truth mixed in with the lies which makes them even more dangerous and harder to spot. However just because they may do some good, and speak some truth, does not mean they should not be corrected and disciplined when they veer off course. That is indeed the call of the prophet, among other things.
EndTimes, I did read the statement of faith before you mentioned it and it does seem to be on the mark. But there is so much going on in the world, like with the copelands, that I could wonder if the statement of faith is realy what you stand by. The “prophesy” is INTENSE one way or the other. Time and God will only tell. May the will of Jeus Christ be done, may God have mercy, but yes, also judgement on those who refuse to repent because people who have been damaged by ones who are false or crooks, and deserve to be able to get justice! And as for me, God lead me because I just want to cry out for TRUE understanding and it is not my desire to get in the way of the LORD’S will being done. I just say…Lord Jesus, it is ALL in YOUR hands, I summit to You Lord, you bring your will to pass in the manner you choose. I think that we can all stand in agreement on that.
Dawn Survivor: you are right not to take things as ‘read’ and question them for it is true there are many decievers. I can only tell you I do not lie about anything I say, and it is up to God to vindicate me and advocate for me.
I know the reason why many ‘Charismatics’ have problems with ‘my’ prophecy is because it is so differant to what they are used to. I am bold, and at times critical, and confontational even, and they are not used to it. However when you go to the Biblical prophets, you can see they were this way too – indeed a lot ‘harsher’. In many ways I am a lone voice when compared to the new breed of prophets who never convict and just speak peace peace.
But truth never has come in the mobs. True prophets have always been in the minority.
If you cannot see what I am now, like you say, in the fullness of time, it will be seen who speaks the truth.
Dawn Survivor:
God bless you. I can see that you have a good heart and are close to the Lord. If you just stay close to Him and prayerfully stay in His Word, He’ll continue to reveal truth to you.
I’m not going to write any more after this letter. This is all in the Lord’s hands, and He’ll take care of it as He sees fit. I do want to say that I could write about 15 pages on what I saw going on in that “church,” Eagle Mountain. I was there four years.
I want to tell you that God Does take pleasure in the prosperity of His servants. That’s the key. His servants are those who have a heart for Him and people, not just for themselves. And I know there are many others who give to the Copelands out of a sincere heart and wanting to bless others.
What false teaching does, however, is put in a lot of truth, and then twist some of it a little bit, and leave out other truths. You can make the Bible say anything you want that way.
God doesn’t want to “get” anybody. However, there is a dangerous false teaching going on nowadays with eternally horrible consequences to the Body of Christ. It’s not just the Copelands teaching this, either.
There are “prophets” and other ministers who teach this nowadays, in complete contradiction to the prophets in the Bible. What they are saying is after you are saved, your sins are taken care of no matter what you do.
This is totally against the words of Jesus in parables and saying, “Not all who say, “Lord, Lord will make it into the kingdom of Heaven. Only those that do His will.” Only born again Christians call Jesus Lord and mean it.
When the whole New Testament talks about the consequences of willful sin, that’s written to the born again Church, not the world. That’s not legalism. Again, with the Lord, it’s a matter of the heart. Do we want to do right, or do we just want to go to Heaven and get blessed, regardless of our heart and the way we treat people?
What they’re saying is people could get born again, destroy as many people’s lives as they want, and still go to Heaven. The Bible says that’s insulting the Spirit of Grace, and counting the Blood of Jesus as a common thing, or as worthless.
The Scripture tells us to remember when we were saved from our Former Sins. In other words, no matter what we’ve done before we’re saved, the slate is wiped clean. But if Jesus is really our Lord, we have to at least want to do right after getting saved, otherwise they’re just empty words. “These people honor Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me.” Again, it’s all about the motives and intents of the heart.
After we’re saved, “If we confess our sin, He is faithful and just to forgive us, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” The converse is, if we Refuse to confess, we are Not forgiven.
Hebrews and Peter tells us we are better off to never be saved at all, then to know the truth and willfully turn away from it. That’s mocking the Lord. And the Scripture says that the Lord judges His people first.
The Apostle Paul said he had to buffet his body (fight the flesh wanting to disobey) daily. Otherwise, even after all he had done, he would find himself a castaway. A castaway is, “Sons of the kingdom are cast into outer darkness.” Again, that’s born again Christians. The Bible says outer darkness is a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth. That’s definitely not Heaven.
The devil will never persecute people who teach that there’s no consequences of willful sin after we’re born again. He loves that. Real Christians are persecuted.
The Copelands and their ilk never are, and they tell you if you are, it’s because of not enough faith or secret sin in your life. They have thought out the things they say very carefully to deceive people. What’s happening to them right now is not the devil, it’s the Lord’s judgment.
If they didn’t give money to people in trouble and other ministries (getting publicity for it), they couldn’t make anybody believe they were a ministry at all. That’s just part of the cost of doing business.
Again, God is not the least bit against money. People need money. Riches are not evil. Poverty is not holy. Nor is it a sin. But we can take anything too far in either direction. “A false balance is an abomination to the Lord.”
Again, God bless you, Dawn Survivor. You have a true heart for the Lord and people, and I’m sure you’ll be just fine.
And thank you, Endtimes. It is true that a true prophet does rebuke (at least in the Bible I read), and that really goes against the grain of ministries nowadays. I don’t think you will be the lone wolf for long, if you are now. I believe the Lord is going to straighten things out and free His people.
I could still go on about Eagle Mountain International “Church” for a very long time, but that’s all I’ll say.
In Christ
Thank you Gary. I know what you say is true. I know it is, and you have helped me, especially when I know you have personal insight into KCM. I knew something was amiss for quite about 4 years, but it seemed that years before I started sensing that about KCM, I had seen good in them. MAYBE I really mistreated EndTimes and if she is truely of the Lord, I do repent. Because in my heart I WANT TO HONOR THE WORDS OF THE LORD, AND RESPECT HIS SERVANTS. I realy do. But I don’t know EndTimes and it kinda felt at the time, like for an (example)…..Gloria was like my mother and I have been being mad at her for lying to me for weeks, really mad! But then someone you don’t know comes along and says something that sounds bad against your mother, (Gloria), and even though you are mad at her, those are fighting words and you are ready to go after whoever had said them because that person is a stranger to you even if she could be right. So you feel you must defend your “mom”. And then there is always that feeling that if the person who said those things, “the prohecy, (Endtimes)” is not correct,…..well then for you to go along with it would really be like going along with evil and ticking-off God! Then you think, but what if EndTimes really is God’s prophet and you just disrespected her? Then I say, well it looks like either way I may just be fixing to get spanked! But I am sure God would see it more seriously than just a spanking offense. But then I say, please Lord, just know my heart and lets go on from there. But as for my long-winded self, I have decided to sever my recently obtained internet connection because it is too expensive and the tax bill just came and I will really need God’s help and a real job to pay some things! But I really needed to grow. And having had access to the internet, and information I never knew, and people like you, and yes maybe even EndTimes….Well, I think I needed it.
Thanks.
This is a fascinating post and I think that I probably agree with you more than I care to admit. I love Jesus but when it comes to modern day prophecies I am more skeptical than I want to be. I would love to see the prophetic validated today but so far all I hear are just voices. Do the prophecies from this website have any track record of accuracy? Are you saying that Kenneth Copeland is sleeping around and Gloria approves of it ?!? Scripture compells me to not recieve an accusation unless it is verified by at least 2 eye witnesses. Have any witnesses come forward to verify this sin? If no witnesses come forward what action are you willing to take? IF your prophecy is not born out I don’t believe that makes you a false prophet, you are not leading God’s people into idolatry, but it does mean you slandered a brother. So by all means please be careful with these kinds of words. And by the way I don’t buy into this “touch not God’s annointed” business. That was an Old Testament principal that has been superceeded by Mathew 18. In the New Testament age all Christians are God’s annointed. That teaching is used almost exclusively by Christian elitists to insulate them from accountability. If you are hearing from the Lord then I hope you continue to be faithful steward. I will keep an eye on this website and if these words come to pass then I will give them more serious consideration if not then you should revaluate how you handle these visions you are having.
Thanks.
To my way of seeing things its quite sad that people regardless of the proof being shown all over the internet and in other places still choose to believe in these Televangelist garbage… they do NOT teach the word of our lord they merely and without shame teach of some strange gospel where wealth and prosperity is their god….i cant fathom how anyone could possibly confuse this with the true word of god??
Temple:
Do you not think I am already careful in what I say, and more than that in testing and weighing all I hear? I was in fact, because of its content, going not to post that one particular claim, but then was convicted by God that I MUST include it, for He said it just as He much he said anything in that one prophesy, and just as clearly. To not post it would be cowardice on my part only.
You misapply scripture – for this context is to do with legal agreements and church discipline for excommunicating, removing from position or otherwise dealing with sin in church leaders. I agree totally that the Copelands should not be disciplined on ‘my’ word alone on this point. There will be evidence on this point, if it has not already yet come to light, to ‘hang’ them with.
I did not say that. I said that she TOLERATED it and this showed apart from other things continued hypocrisy in ministry.
BTW, IF anything I prophesy is shown to be untrue, nobody will discipline me harder than I will myself.
No, it wasn’t even an OT principle, not in the context it is currently misused anyway.
I wouldnt be the slightest bit surprised if both Kenneth And Gloria are having extra marital affairs of some description or other… it would certainly go with their Rich “rockstar” lifestyle
This prophecy is right on. I use to believe in thier message. I was at a conference in Toledo Ohio where Ken Copeland was preaching. When I looked into his eyes all I saw was darkness like a shark. This was 7 years ago and I was afraid of saying anything. Because of what I heard from TBN that God would destroy anyone who comes against his prophets. This word needs to get out. Jesus came to set the captives free from this false gospel of greed and materialism. God forgive me for going astray and following the Copelands instead of following The Holy Spirit. Everyone should renounce all their involvement with ALL word of faith preachers and ask Jesus for forgiveness. Amen In the truth. Randy
joh11:
> … of the proof being shown all over the internet and in other places
I was asking for proof of their adultry not for validity of their teaching.
> I wouldn’t be the slightest bit surprised if both Kenneth And Gloria are having extra marital affairs…
That sounds like gossip to me, you might want to be a little more cautious about that. You might be more correct in your doctrine but comments like this make me think that this is a little too personal for you.
endtimes:
> but then was convicted by God that I MUST include it
Well alright then, you did the right thing. Its a serious word so I had to ask and you appear to be ready to dialogue. Thank you for your response.
I’ve been a christian for a while and I’ve seen words like this convict and set people free from serious sin. I have also seen well intended words like this destroy peoples lives. I have learned the hard way to not to “receive an accusation against an elder except on the basis of two or three witnesses”. I am not going to despise your prophetic utterance but I am going to examine everything carefully and until at least 2 eye witnesses come forward to verify this word it is not confirmed.
> I said that she TOLERATED it
That’s correct, you did write that. I didn’t mean to mistate you, my apologies.
> No, it wasn’t even an OT principle, not in the context it is currently misused anyway.
Agreed, you are correct it is a misused OT principle. I was being too general in my usage but nevertheless there were only a select few that were ‘annointed’ in the OT whereas in the NT all who follow Jesus have ‘the annointing’. And there is no hiearchy in the body of Christ that elevates one brother or sister above another we are all one in Christ (Gal 3:28). I am deeply troubled about our tendency to elevate these christian super stars.
your judgemental comments amuse me temple
there is more than enough evidence to prove that the Copelands are nothing more than Con Artists and fraudsters and yet you still sit in your comfy little chair telling us you want “witnesses”??? cmon get real if you cant see what this blog is on about and where its intentions lie then your living in a world of your own and in deception in your spiritual life.. oh yea and the bit about them “both” sleeping around??? well if you actually read it in Context you would see it says “i wouldnt be suprised giving the “rockstar lifestyle they lead”… it wasnt intended as a fact more a general assessment of the kind of two faced lifestyles these people live 
Endtimes you may like to take a look at this video from KCM.. oddly enough at the start of it they talk about being “naked” and in the darkness… one would almost think perhaps they have visited your site??… take a look http://www.bvov.tv/asx/bvov/080115.asx …..
This is a very evil family. It will come out soon. Marcus Lamb laid hands on me in a revival in January 1997 and told me the Lord had spoken to him six times about me that night. I believe it was January 17, a Friday night.
The Lord led me to Eagle Mountain, and I finally went there starting in March 1998. I never did anything at that church but tithe, at times go beyond the tithe, and try to serve them by being on the traffic team.
After I had been there about a half a year, I started getting a few dirty looks from Kenneth Copeland, George Pearsons, and many, many dirty looks from Terri Pearsons. I had no idea, and still have no idea, why.
This is not crying, and I could say MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more than I am. But a few months after that I started getting harassed by their Associate “Pastors” and the people close to these Associate Pastors.
To this day I don’t know what the lies were, but it caused pure hatred. They couldn’t run me off, and finally threw me in jail for “Criminal Trespassing.” I was a member, had given them thousands of dollars, and had served them on the traffic team. This is the only time I have ever been arrested in my life.
The Lord let me know in February 2005, almost three years after I was thrown in jail for going to that church, that Terri Copeland Pearsons was behind the whole thing. She paid off Stan Nixon, John MacManamy, both Associate Pastors, and maybe others to harass me.
The Lord made me go to the Southwestern Believers Convention one time 2 1/2 months after I was kicked out of church. I won’t even say what happened two days after that, but my wife and I were run out of our apartment and made homeless for six months after that, having to hide in a Buddhist temple.
Gangs of teenagers came by harassing me afater that at the temple, and I finally wrote George and Terri Pearsons, and sent it to Win and Kelli Kutz, certified mail, return receipt requested. Kelli Kutz signed for it. I got the green card back. Nothing was done, but the gangs and harrassment stopped just about two or three days after sending the letter.
The Lord is going to expose these criminals completely. He started showing me that they were a false ministry about a year ago, after letting me know it was Terri Copeland Pearsons behind the whole thing three years ago.
I really don’t give a rip if anyone says I’m crazy anymore, because this criminal family is going down soon. I believe the Lord showed them that I was onto them, and what I would say in the future, and that’s why I was attacked in that “church” for almost three years before they finally threw me in jail since they couldn’t run me out with their horrible lies.
The church had me pose in different positions and took pictures of me out on the parking lot; said it was for the church bulletin. Well, that never came out, but not long after they took those pictures of me at church, the hatred really started. No telling what they did with those pictures.
I am still being harrassed to this day. All of my family and friends from my past know I’ve never been crazy, nor even the least bit off balance. Only my family who aren’t believers thought I was nuts because I was a Christian. Come to think of it, I guess I was crazy to believe the garbage the money worshipping Copelands put out.
What you have said is right on the money, Sister Miriam. It’s good to finally see a true prophet for a change. I might be wrong about this, but the Lord has let me know in my spirit for about a year now that this family is going to be removed from the Body of Christ in an accident.
I believe it will be a plane accident. They are NOT going to heaven, and that’s from promptings from the Lord over and over and over. They are very evil, and they pay off evil people in that money-raising organization they have the gall to call a church to do their dirty work. They have profaned the Lord’s church completely.
I don’t care if any of the Copeland worshippers from Eagle Mountain write attacking me, because all they know are the terrible lies Terri Copeland Pearsons paid Nixon and MacManamy and maybe others to say about me.
I don’t even know if the Lord will let you post this. I know I’m probably not supposed to say anything, but I can’t stand it anymore. I am still trusting the Lord to vindicate me, but maybe He plans to use this blog as part of His plan in doing that and exposing these criminals. Maybe not.
I don’t fear them in the least. The Lord is completely in control, and He’s proven how He protects me over and over. But their time is about up. It looks like John MacManamy ran away to Charlotte, North Carolina. I don’t know where Stan Nixon is hiding. But the Lord does.
Thank you again, Sister Miriam, for telling what the Lord gives you and not being an ear-tickler like so many are nowadays.
Gary:
> They couldn’t run me off, and finally threw me in jail for ‘Criminal Trespassing’
How so? What were the circumstances behind this? Surely they cannot throw you in jail with no reason? Were you actually convicted of a crime in a court of law?
Sister Miram,
What was behind this was I was thrown out first in January 2002 because I finally confronted Larry Satterlee, one of the “Associate Pastors” who is the size of an NFL lineman, who harassed me by following me whereever I sat in the church, trying to intimidate me, for a good two years, along with others close to the Associate Pastors.
I told Stan Nixon what was going on, about being called white trash by the late teen-early 20s boys in the church, almost being attacked on the parking lot by one of them, and even being spit at by one of the security people.
I told him about MacManamy’s constant looks of pure hatred every service, and being watched by the security people constantly like I was a criminal. It was obvious they thought I was some kind of sexual pervert who was after the teenage girls there, and maybe even the little girls, and who knows? Maybe the little boys too. It was ridiculous.
Nixon blew it all off. He told me MacManamy didn’t even know who I was, that nobody can see anybody in the audience from the stage, and that he hadn’t heard a thing about me. He said if anybody thought something unusual about me, he would have heard about it since his flesh-and-blood brother was on the security team.
He whitewashed the whole thing, telling me obvious lie after obvious lie. He knew I had to take it to get back to the church God had ordered me to and not released me from.
Anyway, after a few more months of harrassment, an usher named Steve came up to me at the Veterans Day service, and I couldn’t stand it anymore. I pointed at MacManamy on state (he was a singer on the praise and worship team) and told him, “That man is an adulterer” (The Lord had shown me this before).
Within five minutes, I was called into the hallway, Nixon jabbed his finger into my chest and told me I was not to go to this church again, nor any Eagle Mountain or Kenneth Copeland function anywhere it was being held.
I told Nixon to get his hands off me, and he jumped into a boxing stance and started breathing heavily. He had a buddy of his on either side of him when this was happening.
Later in the week he sent me a letter again telling me to stay away, and that I was mentally sick and delusional, and I had no ideal of what was really going on around me in the church (all of the harrassment). He said if I came back, I would be asked to leave immediately, and if I didn’t do so, I would be arrested for Criminal Trespassing.
I’m sorry this is so long. I could make it a whole lot longer than I am.
On November 6, 1999 at a volunteer workers’ meeting at the church, an usher named Larry (about mid-50s with an older brother named Gerald) came up to me, asked me to give me his hand, and prayed me into the “office” of prophet, or so he said.
He said the Lord had told me about him before, but it wasn’t the time then, but now was the time. This church had set me up for this already before. On the parking lot about six weeks before this, a man drove up to me and said, “The Lord is getting ready to bless you for your faithfulness, Brother. Expect it!”
Maybe a week or two after that, a woman yelled at me in the parking lot, “God is VERY good, to you, sir!” So along with what Marcus Lamb had said before, I believe this Larry character and quit a very good career as an Official Court Reporter for a State District Judge, taking out my retirement (and tithing on it to that church). I had been a Court Reporter since 1978.
The harrassment had already started around August of ‘99, so this was just more of it. After I was kicked out of church, they continued to harass me through the mail, sending me letters asking me to send money (sow seed) to their ministry for a whole year after I was thrown out.
They sent other selected mailings just to harass me, which will take to long to tell. I was a partner with KCM, and they cut off my magazine, though, of course, they continued to send me letters giving me an opportunity to “sow seed” into their ministry so I could be blessed.
I went back to church twice after Nixon kicked me out because the Lord had ordered me there, I had quit my reporting career, had nothing and was desperate. The Lord had also told me (directly spoke to me in my truck) in Tulsa, Oklahoma in June 2000 that my promotion and provision was at EMIC. That’s the only reason I hung on there.
A man who said he was the Executive Director of Kenneth Copeland ministries came out when they were putting me into the Deputy Sheriff’s car, and said that they had a file on me about that (holding his thumb and forefinger together a couple of inches) thick, and that I had assaulted “Pastor Stan” the previous week. This was a week after Nixon had kicked me out and jabbed his finger in my chest.
Nixon lied about that, but got caught there in his lie. Of course, nobody paid attention to me saying it was a lie, even his buddy who was with him when Nixon jabbed his finger in my chest. He knew it was a lie.
When I was finally being arrested the next week for going again (I was desperate, and I thought the Lord would promote me and expose them), Nixon told the deputy I was not a member (he knew I had been a member about four years).
This man just continued to tell blatant lies.
I’m sorry this was so long. They told other lies and did other things (Nixon and MacManamy) after I left the church, but I’ll stop this blog now. The Lord will expose every lie and everything they did.
I know this is a false ministry (The Lord let me know that about a year ago), but as far as I’m concerned, it’s also a criminal organization with criminals (who just haven’t been arrested yet) hired and placed in that church to do their dirty work.
The Copelands will do anything to anybody to keep their money flowing in and keep from being exposed.
Sister Miriam,
Just a short P.S. In my rambling, I forgot to answer your question. The Assistant D.A. asked the judge to throw out the case, and the judge agreed. It took a whole year to get that done, though.
My Court-appointed lawyer, after reading the charges from the church, told me, “This is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever seen. I don’t know why you’re here.” Exact words.
She and another attorney, a family friend, and then even the Assistant D.A. tried to get the church to dismiss the charges, but they refused. They wanted to give me a permanent criminal record, simply for going to church.
So finally the judge just threw out the case.
Gary,
If that is a false ministry (by your own words) then why would God tell you that is where your provision is? I agree with you assessment that the copelands are crooks (I believe occultic). But God wouldn’t have you hang around false teachers. In fact the Bible says to have nothing to do with them. Strong words. Get away from them and don’t look back. Find a solid church that teaches sound doctrine.
gary i have a question?? are the Copelands as plastic looking in real life as they appear on television?? i mean they are bot well and truly advanced in years and from what ive seen they seem to have found the fountain of youth??.. ive often heard Gloria say its Gods will that she stays so fit and young looking?? but im sure somewhere along the line they both must have had quite a bit of cosmetic surgery.. i know they have a personal chef and Gloria has a personal trainer to keep her in shape…and ive read somewhere they are both vegetarians…
I just want to amend my comment about people reading the Holy Bible and being able to find truth… just like the Scribes and Pharisees could read the Holy Texts and yet not understand and apply it (when ‘it’ was walking and talking in flesh before them), apparently many of us are still the same today. We hear and yet not understand, we see and yet not perceive, so some of us are bound to fall by the wayside because of ignorance, stubbornness and/or just a love of the flesh.
Anyway, here’s the guy that finally got me to accept this:
http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=31934
First of all, I feel sorry for all of you that participate in denigrating others with a hellacious and cruel spirit behind the words masquerading as a true prophet of God. The ironic part of it all is that the same tongue you use against others will contribute to your own demise. Why should we believe you when you say God has spoken to you.
What makes you special as though God only speaks to you and only you are living and doing the will of God? You should hear how ridiculous you sound and to me it seems you seek notoriety yet in the name of God you say all these things. I read enough of your garbage and even if some of it is true I see no Spirit of Love in anything you say putting it off on God and how he expressed it to you. Do you even know God is the rhetorical question I put to you. You sound like Haters to me and you begrudge your brothers and sisters in Christ based on their possessions.
As far as I’m concerned we all should repent and follow after God with a true and sincere heart but in this flesh we can never be perfected, so stop trying to act as though you have been and everything you do is so Holy, Holy. Look within yourself and then look at God. He’s right, we’re wrong. The biggest and daunting task placed upon us is to accept His truth while struggling to be free of our own preconceived notions about anything and everything. My prayer for you is that you are successful in your attempt to follow after Jesus, the Christ who is the only way to God the Father. Amen.
Evans you sound exactly like the kind of person Kenneth And Gloria Copeland prey upon…need i say more
Evan
>>Why should we believe you when you say God has spoken to you.
Why should you believe the Copeland’s when they say God has spoken to them? Because they quote from the bible? Because they have a TV show? Because they say so? Or is it because what they say is truly biblical? Obviously you have not taken the latter into account because it is clearer than daylight that what they preach is only half truth.
I hope you don’t believe it is ok for people to deceive others and get away with it? Because if you do, then that’s not very loving is it.
I did not have time to read every post. I want to add some other reports of Kenneth Copeland:
1. I never liked this guy, and I can say I am shooting 100% on first impressions. (Years ago, really good liars could fool me, not now.)
2. Michael Siemer, a carpenter in Tennessee, testified to a freemason (#2 in TN, he said) who confided to Siemer that he has seen Kenneth Copeland at annual Freemason events.
3. Copeland’s first book had the mason symbols – square (seen in the above vision) and compass – on the cover. Masons love to hide their symbols in plain view, as a mockery to the stupidity of God’s people. The heart of Satan is behind this.
I found this site about Copeland’s Mason relationship:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/kennethcopeland33rddegreefreemason.htm
Mary, Joh11, and Evans:
This is just to answer your questions and to make a few comments. As far as I know, this is the last blog I’ll write.
Joh11, the Copelands look in church just like they look on TV. Of course, they won’t talk to anybody in the church. But for that matter, neither will “Pastor Terri” and “Pastor George,” Kenneth’s daughter and son-in-law.
They only come in on Sundays (very seldom on Wednesday nights), and speak solely to keep everybody excited about giving. “Keep sowing. Keep sowing. Keep sowing.” That’s their mantra. “Even if it’s not working (which it won’t for any of them), keep sowing. It will.”
They don’t speak to anybody either. They stay away, and leave the running of the church to their hired guns (Excuse me. Associate Pastors). Even if there’s a big problem with the Associate Pastors, they won’t talk to you. They are not pastors at all, just figureheads to raise money.
Mary, as far as the Lord putting me in a false ministry, all I can say is His ways are higher than our ways. It wasn’t revealed to me until about a year ago that this was a false ministry. I believe He did that to 1) refine me for whatever purpose He has; and 2) to completely expose their evil to everyone.
He has let me know over and over that this is not about me. No, I believe it’s about everyone these evil people have hurt and even destroyed with their lies. As far as refining me, that’s very minor compared with exposing them and stopping them from doing this to others.
The Lord also let me know He is stopping false ministry. So what happens to the Copelands will be very apparent to all of the other crooks who are doing the same thing as the Copelands.
Evans, I don’t know, but I suspect you are an Eagle Mountain member, and maybe even on Terri Pearsons’ payroll. You sounded just like Stan Nixon when I told him what was happening to me in that church.
You completely ignored the lies and criminal things I said they did, and then you called ME unloving. You also made up things accusing me of things I never said. I never said I was special and the only one living for God.
I never said I was the only one so “holy, holy,” as you put it. The Word commands us to be Holy. We’re supposed to at least try to be. Of course, you are never taught that at EMIC. You are only taught to give them money, believe and confess, and it’s comining in. Your behavior and motive means nothing. The big bucks are coming in!
As for the Lord speaking to me, I don’t care what you think (or say you think to try to deflect what’s on the Copelands). The Lord has never done anything with me that’s not in the Scriptures.
He has spoken to me several times since 1995, but not that many times considering how many years that’s been. What He does do with me daily, however, is lead me to Scriptures and give me promptings. He also gives me many promptings throughout the day, even if I’m not in the Word.
This is how He speaks to me. “As many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are the Sons of God.” And I’m not bragging or saying I’m special here either. Anyone that’s born again is an adopted son or daughter of God.
I could be very wrong here because I’m just guessing on this, but I believe you are one of the Pearsons’ and Copelands’ lackeys at EMIC, and I’ll continue to believe it no matter what you say, because of the things you said.
This is not my fight, nor any other persons’ fight. This is the Lord’s fight. When the Lord blesses people, He uses people. When He refines and disciplines people, He uses people. And when He punishes people, He uses people.
Try opening up the Bible to more than the sowing seed (money) scam, and you’ll learn this. As far as unloving, no, I don’t have warm and fuzzy feelings for the criminals after what they did to me and my wife, and both of our families. I could say much more than I did.
However, this is not a cryfest, and it’s not about me. I’m sure they have done worse to other families over the years.
You can defend these criminals all you want, but this is the Lord’s deal, and it’s all over, partner. There’s nothing the Copelands and Pearsons can do, no matter how many people they pay off. Just try, and find out what the Lord does.
Gary they have done worse to other families that and much more.. theres more to the Copelands than just Gloria and Kenneth though.. their dynasty is huge and takes in their children and grandchildren…both Kenneth and Gloria are fairly old… hes 71 ans shes 65… so their reign is not far from over but its moreso Kenneth and Glorias offspring and their offspring that will keep this going long after Kenneth and Gloria have departed this earth… the only way to stop them(Kenneth and Gloria) is through public humiliation and expose to the world of them NOW while they are alive.. at least that way anything or anyone associated with the name Copeland would be looked at in a bad light.
i saw in your post you had said the lord had told you Kenneth and Gloria were going to meet a “sticky end” in some kind of accident??personally i would wish no harm to befall anyone no matter how bad they are.. i guess the only thing is that somehow somewhere these greedy theives must be stopped… how that will happen and when(it seems chuck Grassleys “investigation” might not go very far) as he gave them so much time to answer and even if they did get fund out about rorting tax exmpt funds the most that would happen is they might stand to lose their tax free status… or if they were found to be in breach of IRS laws the “maximum” penalty is about $300,000 and 5 years gaol
Still the public exposure might be good……..
I just have one question for this moderator: WHAT HAS GOD SHOWN AND SPOKEN ABOUT YOU TO YOU?
Dani:
If you read through this blog, then you’d know some of the many things God has spoken to me about me. But that is not really your question is it?
It seems i was right about Copeland “buying” protection from Mike Huckabee… the latest news is Huckabee rang Copeland all upset because his campaign funders had dropped him or hadnt given enough… Copeland was in the middle of a board meeting and “suspended” it to reconvene a special meeting of the “fellow ministers” to donate toward Huckabee,s campaign funds… they raised between them out of their wallets only $111,000 but made promises of over a million dollars…if this isnt “BUYING PROTECTION” exactly what is it??????then to top it off Copeland was joking in one of his TV shows meetings on how Grassley ONLY had an 11% approval rating and how Huckabee was a real good buddy of Good ole Kenny boy…. sad isnt it?? this guy is so arrogant he isnt even waiting until after the election to Gloat… but judging by the poll results on Huckabee it isnt going to make any difference….. i say go GET EM Mr Grassley and give them what they deserve…:);)
Just to “back up” what i had written above…
In a closed-circuit broadcast last week, Copeland pledged “a holy war” against Sen. Grassley and the Finance Committee. His financial records, he said, belong to God.
“You can go get a subpoena, and I won’t give it to you,” Copeland bellowed. “It’s not yours, it’s God’s and you’re not going to get it and that’s something I’ll go to prison over. . . . You wanna get in a faith fight with me? Why, just come on. But I’m gonna warn you, I fight dirty.”
Full article at….. http://www.arkansasleader.com/2008/01/editorialdont-defy-laws.html
It seems this is going to drag on through the courts.. but that alone would be enough to tell anyone that these people(Copelans,Hinn,Myers,Dollar,White etc) are nothing more than con artists… as any REAL decent church would have no problem with making their finances fully transparent
You people are wrong about the Copelands! All Gloria teaches is right out of the bible and her doctrine is all about obeying God and doing what’s right and in doing so you’ll walk in the blessing as promised by God throughout the entire bible. The Copeland family has walked in integrity throughout their entire ministry. As for you who call yourself a prophet, you should pray about from which spirit your so-called vision came from. Anyone who professes to be a Christian but SLANDERS other Christians (or anyone for that matter) is clearly acting against God’s Word. What you’re doing on this web-site is wrong! Why don’t you use your time for something good instead of evil. I stand in agreement with KCM and Eagle Mountain Int. Church that “No weapon formed against them shall prosper and every tongue that rises up against them in judgement they shall condemn.(Isaiah 54:17) You call this a “Christian” Blog? It’s slander and gossip!! The theif (devil)does not come except to steal, kill and destroy and what you people are doing on this blog is just that!!!
Shelly,
Keep drinking the cool aid.
All Gloria teaches are the scriptures they want you to hear, and not the other scriptures that clarify more on the same subject that they don’t want you to hear. The “No weapon formed” scripture applies only to the righteous.
Mouthing “I am the righteousness of God” when you’re doing evil won’t cut it. Read 1 John 3: 7 and 8. That’s written to the church. When you are first saved, you are made righteous. But after that, if you decide to do whatever you please to people, you aren’t the least bit righteous.
“Your do is not your who” is the opposite of what the whole New Testament says about willful sin after you’ve been saved. If your heart is right and you’re trying, and you confess your sins, then you’re forgiven. Otherwise, no. That’s the Bible AFTER BEING SAVED, which is not what’s being preached nowadays.
It used to be these people and the others like them on Christian TV would only tell you to give them your money so you would get a big return back, which is a scam and is nowhere in the word of God. That must not have gotten them enough money, because now they’re also saying to get prayer answered, you need to send them money. For example, if you have cancer. It’s despicable.
The Lord cares much more about your heart and how you treat people than sending these people money. The Lord answering prayer is not for sale.
George Pearson at EMIC said once that if someone is not getting their prayers answered, the first thing he checks is their tithing record. That is absolutely ridiculous, and not the word of God.
Look in the Bible and see who JESUS said to give to, and then how the Apostle Paul said giving was to be done in the New Testament church, and not just picking out the scriptures where giving to the preachers was mentioned while ignoring the scriptures on giving to others.
But if you want, in the words of George Pearsons, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing, keep sowing. (To them, which is good ground. Not to others).
But do it quickly, because you may not be able to “sow” to them much longer.
Shelley,
my former pastor knows K.C. personally, they have both been with Kenneth Hagin.
I know a lot of facts, tales and gossip about K.C. but I did not and shall not tell it. Nor did anyone else on this site, Miriam the least!
A girl friend of mine was engaged with a man who promised her eternal love and marriage under false pretences. Her family and friends soon discovered inconsistencies with her
adored spouse, caught him in lies and “suspicious” situations etc. We tried to warn her, but she refused to listen to anybody (in fact, she called it slander) because she was so in love and absolutely convinced of her Mr.Right.
She trust all her savings to him, and was already pregnant, when the police showed up. Her fiancè was fugitiv , accused
of several crimes, and she had to learn that she was not his only fianceé, there were at least four or five, two of them pregnant and all of them delivered from all their money.
Guess, how the story goes on !
You do not know Kenneth Copeland and you are not able to see the inconsistency in his teachings and behaviour.
You idolize him, according to scripture : sin and curse.
How many aeroplanes does God need?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy64pSBNRxQ
This is a nice video for you to watch.
Heres another video you may choose to watch to hopefully open your eyes Shelley… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6Tx_EqVmzw&feature=related
“But do it quickly, because you may not be able to “sow” to them much longer.”…. Gary i doubt that will come to pass as Kenneth and Gloria have influential friends like Mike Huckabee to back them up against any inquiry.. i see the Copelands merely revamping their business so it doesnt attract as much attention.. sure they may get a rap over the knuckles from Sen Grassley, but with the amount of wealth they have they could pretty much buy themselves out of any situation… i see them being around for quite a while yet somehow…as sad as that is
First of all Arabella(?), I do not idolize “people.”
Secondly, I really don’t get your “point” in your story about your friend. It’s sounds like you’re implying that the “fugitive” in your story is K.C. Even if that was true, it’s none of my business. His inconsistencies and behavior are between him and God. You judge something by it’s fruit. I’m sure K.C. has produced some bad fruit in his lifetime. I think we refer to them as mistakes. You cannot dispute the fact that KCM has produced “a lot” of good fruit. What about ‘this’ minsitry? I certainly don’t see anything ‘good’ coming from the things I’ve read on this web-site. Hoping for destruction on a fellow brother and sister in the Lord is EVIL and that only comes from one place.
The bible says, “To whom much is given, much is required.” The devil is using Senator Grassley as a tool to “try” to attaack the integrity of these big ministries. If they weren’t making such a huge impact on the world no one say anything. Besides, he may (or may not) have an alterior motive for all these investigations. Like for instance, I don’t know, to boost his political ego? Sorry to disappoint you but he won’t find anything. It’s just one of Satan’s tactics.
It’s really sad that people who used to work for KCM have to make up stories to draw attention. What they report is based on their opinion and not on fact. They play right into Satan’s hands. It’s also sad how Satan can use Christians to back bite other Christians and carry out ‘his’ will. I’m glad they are gone from the ministry!! They allowed sin to enter into their heart to betray KCM. The Lord hates discord among the brethen! (Prov. 6:19) Satan got kicked out of heaven for causing discord.
As for you, Gary, you seem to have too much time on your hands. We’ve all read your side of the long, long, story about your incident(s) with EMIC . But you know the saying. “There’s two sides to every story.” Just like I said before, God hates discord among the brethen and that’s why you got kicked out of my church. Call it what you want, but you came to EMIC to sow discord and you got the same result Satan got when he got kicked out of heaven. You still have time to repent.
You say that sowing seed is a scam. I guess that would be like saying God is con-artist being that He is the one who established the seed time and harvest principal at the beginning of creation. Read Genesis and 2Cor.9:10-15. Sowing seed into a ministry and being partners with a ministry is scriptural. (Phil.4:14-19) Seed can be other things besides money. It can also be words. If you want to know if this principal works, take a look at your life and see what you’ve become. You are the prophet of your own life. “Life and death are in the power of the tongue and those who love it will eat it’s fruit.” (Prov. 18:21)
You say that God cares more about people’s hearts than if we give money. God cares about ‘obedience’ which is connected to the heart of a person. You don’t “buy” a miracle. Whatever God tells you to do you do it because you know He loves you and you want to please Him and He’s looking for faith to get something to you. It doesn’t always have to do with money. The bible says in Hebrews 11:6 that “He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.”
Gary, the Word says if you are not tithing, you are robbing God. (Mal.3:8) God is very interested in a person’s finances. Your tithe is a first fruit of your income. Deut. 26:10-11 “Then you shall set it before the Lord your God and worship before the Lord your God.” Tithing is worship and that is connected to the heart. If you give grudgingly, He will not be pleased. God loves a “cheerful” giver (2Cor 9:7). If you are tithing, He says He will open the windows of heaven and pour you out a blessing that there won’t be room enough to receive it and He will rebuke the devourer for your sake. Mal (3:10-11) Is your money being devoured?
It’s obvious that this ministry has an agenda to slam the prosperity message and all those who preach it. You should take that up with The Lord because He’s the one who instated that message when he made a Blood Covenant with Abraham and to his seed. “I will bless you and make your name great and you shall BE A BLESSING.” (Gen. 12:2) The bible has more to say about prosperity (which means more than just money) than about salvation. God wants His children wealthy so we can give to others in need. This brings Glory to God and it’s all about Him. Obviously, there is a lack of knowledge regarding the Blood Covenant and what it stands for. I can suggest some great authors on the subject: Kenneth Copeland, Jesse Duplantis, Creflo Dollar just to name a few. Oh, but according you, they’re all false teachers too because they preach prosperity. So you people who are connected to End Time are persecuting Jesus when you preach against what His Word says. It is the will of the devil to keep God’s children in the dark about this message. The prosperity is what spreads the “true” gospel of Jesus Christ. So I can see why Satan wants it stopped. As for the material things, the old testement is full of people who followed the statutes of God and they were extremely wealthy and lived the good life. God does not change. What He did for them, he’ll go the same for you if you will diligenly hear and do all His commandments (Deut. 28). When the wise men came to Jesus after His birth, Bible History Scholars estimated that Jesus received approximately 200 million dollars worth of gold and other gifts. God is all about living the Good life.
You people with End Time may be wagging your heads and saying I’m lost as a goose and to you I say, “whatever.” I’m not a follower of anyone except Jesus and His Word. No one who supports End Time has said ‘anything’ that lines up with God’s Word on this blog. Not even that “SICK AND TWISTED” vision posted on this blog.
I advise End Time and friends to reflect on Romams 2:1 “Therefore you are inexcuseable, O man, whoever you are who judge, for in whatever you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things.”
Romans 2: 1-11
From what I’ve read about your sick vision and the way you are ‘broadcasting’ it making Gloria Copeland out to be some kind of monster is dispicable!!! God does not give visions to people about other people’s sin!! That is a personal matter between that person and Jesus! You said yourself you don’t know anthing about her yet you claim she is a false teacher. The spirit you listen to is not the Holy Spirit. Repent while you still can.
Shelly
>The devil is using Senator Grassley as a tool to “try” to attack the integrity of these big ministries
Ha ha ha ha ha, that is the funiest thing I have heard – but really sad too that you are blind to these people’s obvious greed. And you think they have integrity?! Wow, that takes some delusion.
It does not take a prophet to know these people are crooks. Even you know deep down if you will but admit it.
Shelly,
I suspect you won’t be commenting anymore but if you do answer me this: How do you reconcile the prosperity gospel with Jesus’s own words that in this world you shall have tribulation? or love not the world nor the things of the world. or man cannot not love both God and mammon? or
the servant is not greater than his master for if the world hated me it will hate you. or money is the root of all evil or we are aliens of this world?
You take one verse horribly out of context and build your whole sorry theology on it and follow the very people who will lead you to hell cause that kind of thinking is not found amongst the disciples Shelly. Are you and your pet teachers better than them? The Copelands are better and they deserve to live in the lap of luxury? As I said Shelly,
drink the cool aid.
Shelly,
I’m making one reply to you, and that’s it. The people who were there at EMIC when I was there know I didn’t go to EMIC to sow discord. I am a very quiet person, and when I was at that church I didn’t say anything to anybody.
I served on that traffic team for one year, until I finally gave up because of all of the looks of hate I took out there on the parking lot, when I was just trying to serve them.
I was there over a year before the harrassment started against me, and the whole time I was there, I came to church, sat quietly, didn’t say a word to anybody, and took the hatred.
You just flat made a lie up about me going there to sow discord.
I also tithed to those people and gave beyond the tithe. I gave them over $10,000 in 1999 alone. The money I gave them went way down after that because they told me I was called into the ministry and even prayed me into the ministry.
This was done in the hallway in front of the sanctuary on November 6, 1999. After that, and because of things two people said to me in the parking lot just before that, I believed them and left my career, thinking I was preparing for the ministry they “prayed” me into.
You must be a typical Copeland and Pearsons follower to make up a bald-face lie like that. You fit right in there with them.
You people don’t believe God judges evil Christians. You believe all you have to do is get saved, then mouth, “I am the righteousness of God,” no matter what you do and how much you lie, and you’re righteous. You’ll find out someday just how wrong you are.
You really don’t believe what the scripture says about God bringing justice and delivering His people from evil no matter who, how many, or how they come against someone. Terri and her gang don’t believe that either, even though they preach it. They believe they can really get away with this.
God is absolutely no respecter of persons, and you’re going to find that out. After what these criminals did to me and my family, all I can say is HOW DARE YOU!!!!! You dare to call yourself a Christian.
I hate to burst your bubble, sister, but there are people investigating what these people have done to me. They’ve been investigating it for a while now. Just watch what happens to your heroes soon.
Go ahead and make up more lies about me, because if you do, you’ll be exposed along with the rest of them. I’m not answering you again.
Shelley,
it might highly satisfy you, that Kenneth Copeland recently
said, he will fight back dirtily.
Gary, be at peace brother, I pray you will find his perfect peace.
Shelly, one little P.S. You showed that you really need to read more of the Bible than the small pieces of scripture taken out of a book here, a book there, and like that all through the Bible instead of reading anything in context, which is the way the Copelands “teach.”
You said that God doesn’t reveal someone’s sin to other people. You really need to read your Bible. That’s exactly what He does in the Bible.
The Lord had prophets rebuke people many times with words He gave them to give to those people. Of course, you know nothing about that, because the Copelands never mention sin. They only want you excited about giving to them, and thinking God will never judge you no matter what you do.
EMIC devoured my money by lying to me about being called to the ministry. Which is the same thing as the devil, come to think of it.
God is a God of justice, and your heroes are going to find that out soon.
Miriam,
Thank you.
I like Mary,s response..”drink the cool aid”
but seriously we should be about INFORMING these poor lost souls rather than confronting their very beliefs(as misguided and sad as they are )..Shelly please open your eyes and heart to the REAL Jesus not the false Je$u$ the Copelands have mislead you to believe in…we pray for you
Shelly, as far as prosperity preachers go, I would like to know why there are so many other Christians in places other than America (and even some in America) that live in poverty, but still faithfully serve God anyway because they love Him, not because He will make them rich if they give Him their money. God is after our hearts, not our money. How many times have I heard people quote the verse that says “God owns the cattle on a thousand hills” when they want something from Him? These people are dying from persecution because they love God so much. Here in America, I often wonder what would happen if that was the case here. How many people would fall away because of the prosperity teachings and the like? Yes, we should give to those in need, but when I have been involved in church politics in the past, I could see that most of the money people gave was being used to maintain a building and pay some staff people, with a very, very small portion going to feed and clothe the poor.
Shelly
It appears to me that your sole purpose for belonging to the KCM or EMIC or whatever and being a ‘Christian’ is nothing but prosperity. I just read your post and your comments to Gary were shocking to say the least. I’ve only got one thing to say to you; I rebuke the spirit that is deceiving you in the name of Jesus Christ!!!
End Time and friends:
THE SWORD CUTS BOTH WAYS. One day everyone including Miriam will stand before God and give an account. At that time you will not be able to whine and complain about how the Copelands deceived the world according to you. You are convinced that you are right and everyone else in wrong. You are ‘very’ defensive and accuse everyone who challenges you that they don’t read their Bible.
It should be a RED FLAG for a ‘true’ follower of ‘CHRIST’ to read on this blog that there are people claiming to love The Lord but are stating things such as:
The Lord told me (Gary) that the Copelands’s mininstry will end in an accident that it would probably be a plane accident. John 10:10 Jesus said: “The THEIF comes except to steal, kill and destoy. I have come that they may have life and have it more ABUNDALNTLY.” Was Jesus calling Himself a theif?
And the real kicker is: The Copelands are not going to heaven.
Wow! That is considered to be a judge of someone’s heart and there is only one judge and it’s not Gary or Miriam.
Gary, you need to forgive the people at EMIC and move on with your life. You seem to know the bible so well so surely you are familiar with the scripture in Mark 11:25 “Whenever you stand praying if you have anything against anyone, forgive him, that your Father in heaven my also forgive you your trespasses.
And don’t respond back to me and say that you have forgiven them. It’s clear by your messages on this blog that you have not.
Gary, I did not lie about you. You said in one of your messages that you told one of the ushers that a man on the music team at EMIC was an adulter and it escaladed from there! Come on Gary! You didn’t think that would cause trouble? Where is the love of God in that? Oh excuse me, you have appointed yourself to expose people of their sin so they can repent. Don’t you know that the Bible says that the devil is the accuser of the brethen? You ’say’ you are on the Lord’s side but your actions are EVIL!
Endtime I feel sorry for you. There is no love in what you’re doing. I hate what you’re saying about Gloria Copeland. It’s pure EVIL!!
Gloria Copeland has led thousands of people to the Lord and you hate her for all the good that she has done. Glory be To God! Go Gloria!!!!!
I’ll say it again, YOUR ARE AGAINST THE PROSPERITY MESSAGE and all who preach it. You hate the fact that KCM has impacted the world with the Gospel. You despise the fact that they have been rewarded ‘by God’ for their 40 years of ministry and as long as they contintue to hearken to God’s commandments, THE BLESSING OF THE LORD will continue on them and their ministry and all the false visions and false teachings you can dish out won’t stop it. Glory To God!
There is no way people are going to come to the Lord after reading all the hate messages on this blog. That’s the message you are sending.
If you think, you will not be judged by God and that everything you’re doing is right, you are deceived. You’re so sure everyone who listens to Paula White, Joyce Meyer, Copelands, Creflo Dollar, Jesse Duplantis, Benny Hinn, TBN, DayStar and all the other ‘real’ ministries that are winning the lost are all going to hell. Well that’s several million people.
And YOU are out of context when you say that man cannot serve God and mammon. No, YOU SERVE GOD ‘WITH’ YOUR MAMMON and that brings Glory to God! Read you’re Bible!!
End Time, you can continue this ridiculous blog. But you are out numbered by the lives who have been changed by all these ministries you so despise. How can so many of us be wrong and so few of you be right?
If you think hell is going to be more full than heaven Miriam, you are sorely mistaken. (Revelation 7:14)
“The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.” (2 Peter 3:9) That includes “all of us” and you too, Miriam.
Miriam, please do not repond and tell me I’m out of context. That’s what you say to everyone who quotes scripture to you. You will never convince me that you are right because I know a message of love and your’s is not.
Good-Bye.
I’m making another comment about Copeland’s ministry and EMIC. I know exactly what they teach. I started following them in 1994, and was a partner with KCM until 2002, when they cut off my magazine, but kept sending letters asking for money.
From 1994 until about 2000, I didn’t watch secular television except for the news. All I watched was TBN and Daystar (also when it was Channel 29). I tithed and went beyond the tithe, even giving a thousand dollars to these “ministries” a few times off of my credit cards because I was told that would get me my jackpot, out of debt, etc.
All of my disposable income in that time period went for Copeland and his buddies’ tapes, and some books. I got a tremendouns amount of them. Also Southwestern Believers Convention tapes.
I also studied Kenneth Hagin Sr.’s teachings, Charles Capps’ teachings, and probably others I can’t remember now.
I know exactly what these people teach. All I did for a good seven years was absorb their teachings. I fell for it hook, line, and sinker. However, the Lord started revealing to me about a year ago the Copelands were a false ministry, and giving me revelation on how they do it. The Copelands aren’t the only false ministry.
He is the one who is shutting down false ministry. People read the scriptures on His promises of deliverance and justice and others, but they don’t really believe it in the real world.
What they don’t realize is the Lord is also in control of people’s hearts when He wants to be. That’s scriptural. He can get anything done He wants to.
I could go on and on and on about the obvious false things Copeland has said, and much more that happened when I was in church and even after I wasn’t there anymore, and even to this day. But the Lord will get that revealed in His own way.
I’ve been to many churches in my life, and never have I seen a church where the pastors and people act like they did at EMIC, raising their hands to God, and then glaring at me with pure hatred and harrassing.
I believe a lot of the people there aren’t even Christians; they’re just attracted by the message that big money is coming their way. They certainly didn’t have Christian hearts.
The only other thing I want to mention is “Evans” and “Shelly” have shown the character of the Copeland ministry and EMIC.
When I wrote what happened to me at EMIC, “Evans” threatened my life. Read his blog. He said what I said about them would contribute to my demise. Then “Shelly” made up a bald-faced lie about me going to EMIC to sow discord, and that’s why I was kicked out.
The Lord just let me know this morning that “Shelly” was one of them in on the scheme against me. All He let me know about “Evans” was that he was from EMIC.
You people don’t realize just who you’re up against. I am completely helpless in the flesh, and totally dependent upon the Lord for vindication and justice.
I know the court system well, and the only reason I didn’t drag your tails into the courtroom is because I’m totally depending on God to deliver me in His way. This is His deal, and you crooks don’t stand a chance.
You are dependent on your lies and schemes and sticking together in your lies and schemes, and I’m dependent only on the Lord.
In the words of Bishop T.D. Jakes, “Get ready. Get ready. Get ready. Get ready. Get ready.”
You’re getting ready to see just how real the scriptures on protection and deliverance are, and that the Lord means what He says when you mess with His children.
End Time and friends;
The Lord knows the heart of every man and woman. Including your’s, Miriam. You may have a lot of people fooled but not The Lord. You are so sure ‘you’ know what’s in Gloria’s heart, but the ‘truth’ is YOU DON’T!!
Leave the judging of people’s hearts to ‘The Lord’ I can promise you He does not need your help revealing other people’s sin.
For the record that IS really out of context – God does not will that any should go to hell which is why he sent the prophets to warn and direct and then sent Jesus but it does not mean that the majority will accept the message, repent and be saved. I am shocked that someone who claims to know the Bible is so ignorant of this basic fundamental gospel fact.
Shelly:
I do not hate Gloria Copeland. I hate some of her teaching and her behaviour though. And God hates it too. It is robbery. It is mockery. It is fraudalent. It is selfish. It is evil. It is twisted. It is vile. It is distorted. It leads astray. It binds and ensnares. It is a lie.
>> You are so sure ‘you’ know what’s in Gloria’s heart, but the ‘truth’ is YOU DON’T!!
And you DO know what is in her heart? Really? Wow.
She is great, loving and genuine, because she SAYS so? It is very easy for any wolf to appear genuine when you want people to send you some money. And don’t all the best con-men look like the real deal anyway as when people are being conned, they do not think ‘this is a conman’, they think ‘this person is trustworthy’. Because she CLAIMS to be the real thing you accept it and cannot possibly think your idols would lie to you. Think again and wake up and stop being so naive – people lie all the time including in the church.
>> You are so sure ‘you’ know what’s in Gloria’s heart, but the ‘truth’ is YOU DON’T!!
But out of the overflow of the heart, the mouth speaks. And I hear lies coming from her mouth and twisted truths. So even someone who is not prophetic can test and weigh this woman and find her to be a false teacher, and be living a lifestyle that is not biblically compatible.
And as well as lies I see a very greedy mammon centred and self centred lifestyle which the apostle John says does not belong to the people of God. If you want to say Gloria is walking right and following God then go ahead, but it is not the God of the Bible, it is the god of this world she follows and this is evident to any scholar of scripture.
You serve GOD with your mammon do you? Or more like you serve HER – these so-called ministries – for where does the money actually go to that is supposed to be given to God? Have you seen how they live and spend the money that is given to GOD? Do you think God is glorified by gold-plated bathrooms in marble clad palaces, ridiculously priced designer costumes, and lots of planes that frequently take them and their family and friends off for very expensive holidays that have nothing at all to do with ministry? Are you OK funding these frequent jollies. But of course you are, they are God’s anointed. Yeah right!
What would it take for you to open your eyes to see that their behaviour is not good? If God Himself spoke to you in an audible voice would you believe it? If angels came down and said she is a fraud would you believe it? If prophets you accepted spoke it out would you believe it? But why would you believe these things when you already ignore the law and the prophets and the testimony and spirit of Jesus and the ample evidence that is right before your (and anybody elses) eyes.
The truth is, you and others like you believe her because you want to. Because you are greedy too and at the heart of it love mammon and lies more than God and truth. You are decieved because you want to be decieved, blind because you want to be blind. This is because as scripture says you do not love the truth and willingly give yourself over to believe the liers and their lies. It is not we, but you that need to repent on this matter.
Well, Shelly, you lied again. I was persecuted because of lies and schemes horribly for almost three years before I told that usher about John McManamy. I was kicked out of church right then.
It had been full persecution way before I said anything to that usher, and the people at EMIC know that.
You need to read Proverbs 6:16-19, and a lot more also. That thing about not revealing sin is the same garbage I got from Pastor Jim and Chris Wilder, two of the leaders in that “church,” when I told them what McManamy and others were doing to me.
There is no recourse for the EMIC sheep when evil Associate Pastors come against them. They won’t do a thing about it. The sheep are only good for volunteer work and giving the money, which pays the pastors.
And by the way, lady, what about all of the horrible “sins” that the pastors said I did that got me persecuted? Why did they reveal that? Your heroes don’t follow what you say about keeping sin secret. Your argument is blown to pieces by the behavior of the “pastors” at EMIC.
Again, I was told the persecution was my imagination by Nixon, and he hadn’t heard a thing about me. All the while he was spreading the lies, whatever they were.
God is a God of justice, lady, and He means what He says about lying about others. You’ll see soon just what the Lord thinks about the Copelands and their “ministry.”
The other thing is, how can this be happening to the Copelands? They always teach that we always have victory, and that if something bad is happening to us, we don’t have enough faith.
He arrogantly says, “
Continuing, “You lost at the faith game.” Well, it looks like the Copelands lost at the faith game.
Again, God is in complete control of what’s going on, and you’ll see what the truth is soon.
Shelley: >> If you think hell is going to be more full than heaven Miriam, you are sorely mistaken. (Revelation 7:14)
Hehehe, goodness, I suppose you haven’t read this verse or do you only read what KCM tells you to read: Matthew 7:13 “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.
Couldn’t find a better place to link this: http://theuglytruth.wordpress.com/2008/02/10/the-difference-between-heaven-and-hell/
Please read, it’s a very interesting ‘parable’ about the difference between heaven and hell.
Shelley…. to put it quite Simply for you….. When was the last time Kenneth Or Gloria Copeland Hugged you or shook your hand??? my Minister does it every week
Be at Peace
If this doesnt say it all i dont know what does… these people are NUTS…. http://www.thespeciousreport.com/news.aspx?newsnum=7070158
IT IS BETWEEN GOD AND HIM
How we deal with sin :
1. How do we know, somebody is sinning ? 2 tim 3,16
scripture defines sin. The spirit John 16,8 will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin.
Under condition, the spirit dwells in us, we can discern sin,
comp.John 4,18-26 (I who speak am He), John 14,12
2.Are we allowed to prove ?
John 8,46 “Can anyone of you prove me guilty?”
Eph 5,10 Rom 12,2 2 Cor 13,5
Gal 6,4 1 Thes 5,21 1 Joh 4,1 We have the duty to do !
3.Must we not judge ?
Do not judge (= condemn). Unless we take out the plank of our eyes,then we too can easily risk to be judged as well.
Then you will see clearly to remove … We ought to remove the speck ! And, we will see clearly !
If you make it a commandment not to judge , you are twisting scripture !
Does “Do not touch the annoyted and do no harm my prophits”
apply to the question ? Why did Jesus never quote it ?
Please note, to harm /touch means kill or wound, not question or test.
4. Do we have to expose sin and counterfeit ?
Eph 6,12 and do not forget the Armor of God. 2 Cor 10,1-5
” we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience…v.6
every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God !
1 Cor 5,12 :Are you not to judge those INSIDE ? God will judge those outside.
Gary,
You said in #150 that you would not comment to me anymore. I obviously have offended you and I aplogize. I’m sorry you had a bad experience at EMIC.
I regret stumbling across this blog. However, since I did, it has really stirred me to be ‘more’ diligent to pray for my church and all the other ministries I parter with.
I’m glad there is an investigation. That way the truth will be revealed. Just remember, just as you reserve your right to privacy, KCM still has privacy rights as well and just because they choose to exercise them does not mean they are hiding something.
I ‘do not’ agree with the comment K. Copeland made “I fight dirty.” I will not justify his comment.
End time and friends,
I cannot continue this dialogue. This blog was designed to tear people down and I do not want to be a part of it.
Good-bye
Joh: I think that link is fake news isn’t it/a joke?
Shelly,
It is absolutely not about tearing down somebody. It is about edification and growth. Often, to create something new, you have to destroy first. To be found in Christ’s resurrection, you have to be made conformable to his death.
It hurts.
We all have been suffering the consequences of our sins and errors.
We do not want to remain in sin and deception or, worse to
vindicate and justify them.
We can not buy our salvation and sanctification with faith-seed. I am still frightened with shame that I once tried to.
Do not partner with ministries. Partner with the living God.
Shelly, your fake apology after you’ve been exposed for your lies means nothing. The only reason you said that is you’ve been exposed, and people can see you’re a false ministry just by the scripture other people are quoting when compared to the way you quote scripture to support your and ‘your’ family’s false teaching.
Criminals don’t commit crimes against people, be arrogant about it, then when they’re pubically exposed, say “I’m sorry,” and that’s it. You and your family will pay for your crimes.
The judgment of the Lord is all over ‘your’ family. This is just the very beginning. You say not to expose sin, and it’s between your family and the Lord. That’s totally against scripture. You just don’t want your and your family’s sins exposed, and everybody (even the EMIC people fooled up to now) can see that.
The Lord reveals sin to people to have it exposed. Sometimes it’s just to that person or persons, but when they refuse to repent like ‘your ‘family, it goes public. You people completely disobey and go against scripture.
You pretend like scripture you don’t like doesn’t exist.
You can reserve your right to privacy, but it won’t do you any good. Again, you don’t believe the Lord can or will expose you. You depend totally on the flesh and sticking together, or on Egypt, and you’re going to see how futile that is.
I didn’t plan to write you again, until you arrogantly (of course. That’s ‘your ‘family) lied and attacked me. You people have no remorse at all for the lives you destroy. You are sociopaths.
You also haven’t answered one thing about what I said you all did to me in church. That’s because you can’t. This is only the beginning of your public exposure.
Who knows? I might write you 100 more times? We’ll see. Bye for now (maybe), “Shelly.”
Shelly, what I said about the Copelands not going to heaven isn’t from me. I know I’m not the judge. I would not dare to say that the Lord told or revealed by His Spirit something to me that He didn’t, because I don’t pretend that the judgment scriptures don’t exist like your heroes’ ministry does.
I have gotten that from the Lord over and over, and still get it from Him. Eternity is a long time to gamble with. But believe what you want.
Kenneth Copeland makes up all of his conversations he says he has with God. The Lord does not speak to him. I’ve gotten that also from the Lord.
The Lord does not speak to liars, theives, and arrogant con-men. There is no love of Christ at all in Kenneth Copeland’s eyes. I’ve heard him say several times about how he wants to beat people up when they don’t pay him, or cheat him with bad fruit from the grocery store, et cetera.
He also said, “If you hurt one of my kids, you’ll find out I’m not that sanctified.” Actually, he’s not sanctified at all.
He even acted like the Lord just spoke to him, saying, “Thank you, Lord,” and then telling the congregation that God just told him that Jesus bore His (God’s) grief on the cross.
God has no sin in Him. Jesus didn’t have to bear anything on the cross for Him. That should tell everybody that he’s lying.
He also said at EMIC that he’s a prophet because God told him nobody else would do the job, so God made him into a prophet. What an absoloute joke. People have the call of prophet from birth on them, though it doesn’t come out until later.
He makes these obvious mistakes because he’s not following the Holy Spirit. But people swallow every obvious lie he says, going, “Amen, Amen.”
If you want to see what’s coming on the Copelands, read some of the Book of Lamentations, starting at the beginning.
It’s really rough when people find out you’ve been lying and stealing from them, and you’ve been doing that to people all over the world. There’s nowhere to run or hide.
As anyone can see from my past blogs on this site, I struggled with what to believe about the Copelands and about Ms. Endtimes, but I believe now that this whole thing what is going on here is not of God. Kenneth and Gloria claim they come in the name of the Lord. Well, I believe it is up to God to deal with them and He is big enough to do it WITHOUT ANY OF US if they have sinned against HIM and HIS flock!!! I repent for my big mouth before God and also in a letter to the Copelands. (Weather they read it or not, God has seen it!) I am not saying that like I am better than any of you because I have done that, I am just saying that because after all of this time seeking answers….I beleive I have got them! And yes I am happy and relieved for that and I also now feel it is a shame what is going on here. God can back hand the whole bunch in a moments time if they are as wrong and evil and misleading as some here have said. I have come to the conclusion of that. And if He so wanted, He can have it for the whole world to see! Yes God has worked like this (with prophets) in the Old Testament, but even though I may not be very learned about things, just something in my spirit says this is wrong, except for the fact that this site makes us be able to question “who are we following?” I mean the Lord Jesus, or are we being a “Televangelist groupie”?! They may truely have been used by the Lord and things just got away from them and now it is time to REALIZE some things where they were not being Christ centered, repent and get on with doing things right. Hey, I am not going to crucify them here like some of you are doing! The only one that I benefited from having been crucified was my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. His sheep hear HIS voice and they do not need your website as much as you may think! And GARY, you seem nice and you may be being 100% truthfull, only God will know…. I think out of fear I acted like O no, O no, O no….Who do I trust now! Now that I am more centered I say….Trust the Lord Jesus Christ, not any man. You are God’s daughter, you hear His voice, not just some person with a blog page!!
I feel set free and peacefull now! How about all of you?
D A W N S U R V I V O R.
Dawn:
If you responded out of fear, then that is wrong, no matter what message you were responding to. However I did not tell you to fear. I do not see other people telling you to fear either. If you acted wrongly then we cannot be responsible for that – and regardless of how your emotions reacted, it does not make what I say any the less true.
You use a very foolish argument when you say God can tell us Himself if we need to be warned about false teachers. Apart from how does God speak to people anyway (with the written word of God and the prophets as well as direct personal revelation) your argument goes against what the whole Bible teaches. If God could just tell people what they need to know (and he could indeed, as well as strike everyone dead and do miracles in front of theirr eyes all the time and send them angels all the time and put a big red arrow over all false teachers), then there would be no need for evangelists, missionaries or even pastors and teachers. If it was as easy as you say then the apostles need not have spent so much time refuting false teachers and Paul would not have taught Timothy to do this. But God works in co-operation with man and use our fallible mouths as watchmen and warners – which you know, right? And you also know, if you will but admit it, that the Copelands do not teach the truth and are robbing the flock. Would you let robbers outside the church get away with robbing and stealing you, your family, your friends? So why will you let the robbers alone inside the church? Don’t you care?
Hmmmmmmm it seems this whole question of what we are trying to expose to people here is getting out of hand.. i think the easiest and best way is to tell it as it is plain and simple..i dont think any of us have anything to gain by exposing these people as the frauds they are but we merely do it out of compassion for others who are (for some unknown reason) blinded by the glitz and glamour of the Copelands sideshow… sure Kenneth and Gloria look real on the outside… but just listen a little bit closer to what they really say?? noone is suggesting that prosperity for gods children is wrong… but read your bible it doesnt say anywhere that greed is right either….oh and just to throw a “spanner in the works” ive often heard Gloria tell the same story over and over about how they lived in a small shack with no furniture and a littel Black and white TV etc… i hate to be the bearer of bad news… but that in itself is a lie…Kenneth Grew up in a family where his Father was a prominent Businessman kenneth learned business as a young man and also wasnt that bad off finacially ( bear in mind he had flying lessons from a very young age( and they themselves are not cheap) in the period where Gloria described her poorness Kenneth was a pilot for Oral Roberts… and as a commercial pilot he would have been earning good money….im sorry but people need to OPEN their eyes and see the real truth… not just the glitzy glamouriesd version being force fed to them by people like the Copelands trying to build their $$$ empires
Like I said before, the Lord showed me this is not about me. This is about many, many people who are having their lives destroyed. I can’t speak for you, Dawn, but I think I understand where you’re coming from.
I believe you might see this as a bunch of people ganging up on somebody, and you feel sorry for them for being picked on. I can understand that. I was slandered by them in their church and ganged up on for years before being thrown out for telling the truth to an usher about the Associate Pastor who was the most hostile of all of them to me. It’s not fun to be ganged up on.
But this is about people who are desperate and down to their last dollars, and being lied to in the name of Jesus to get their money, including old people who don’t have enough to live on as it is. This is a terrible thing.
When criminals outside the church commit crimes, they have to pay for it. People hiding behind the name of the Lord shouldn’t be able to get away with their crimes just because they pretend to be good Christians.
And yes, I said crimes. I wrote three other blogs that the Lord didn’t let Miriam post, but they’re in the hands of the right people.
Throughout the Bible, when God came against evil people, including His own (Israel), he brought other people against them. God is not helpless. He knows how to turn people’s hearts around, and have the people rise up and put a stop to it.
But no, I don’t believe the Copelands will repent. The Bible talks about having your conscience seared with a hot iron. This just means after someone does evil for so long, or rejects the Lord for so long, their hearts are so hardened that they can’t repent and come to Him even when they know the truth, even to save their eternal destiny.
The Copelands have done this for so long, they have no feeling at all for what they do to people. Their children and grandchildren (for the most part all grown now) no nothing else, so I don’t believe they can have any feeling for what they do.
So the Lord is going to have to remove them. But people saying, “Let the Lord take care of it,” well, the Lord works through people. If He reveals what they’re doing to people, and then the people disobey Him and keep quiet because of fear or upsetting people, then He can’t do anything about the evil.
The Lord is in the process of revealing the truth to people and changing their hearts, and this blog is only a part of it. He also has to do it in a way to stop their children and grandchildren from carrying on this family business that is all they know.
Too true Gary and well said.. the Copeland Dynasty will be of its own down bringing and Kenneth and Gloria will pay the ultimate price…i saw in the Copelands Myspace page that Gloria has just turned 66 and Kenneth is 71 i believe.. they still have some time left here on earth if they repent of their ways.. but i doubt that will happen
God is a God of justice. Sometimes it takes quite a while for the justice to come, but if we keep trusting and believing Him, He will bring that justice.
This is for the leadership of Kenneth Copeland Ministries and Eagle Mountain International Church. The Lord led me to Ezekiel 3:16-21 this morning. I am going to obey, regardless of the outcry, because if I don’t, the Lord will require your blood at my hand. I’m not going to have that on me.
The Lord is absolutely furious at the evil in your ministry and church. He has led me to Old Testament judgment scriptures concerning you for years now. Yes, He is patient, but He doesn’t give Carte Blanche to sin. His patience has run out.
I told Nixon that MacManamy was going to die back in January of 2002. I had that from the Lord. I did not know at the time who was behind what MacManamy was doing to me, or why. I do now, Terri. Nixon’s pupils in his eyes got as tiny as a pinhead in fright, but then he recovered and just kept up his lies.
The word of the Lord to this wicked leadership is You Shall Surely Die if you do not repent. The Lord is Not putting up with you anymore. If your pride and arrogance keeps you from doing so, you will be made an example to everyone else.
You have mislead the people in your church and under your ministry. Many of them are new to the Lord and are not getting the truth. They have been taught that they are the righteousness of God regardless of their behavior, which is totally against the word (1 John 3:7,8).
Even “Shelly” (ryhmes with Kelly, right?) said there would be more people in heaven than in hell. Has the devil gotten you people that ensnared? Do you really believe that? Do you really believe God does not judge evil?
The Bible says Few go to heaven. You are sending people to hell with your false teaching, just so they’ll stay excited to give you their money. That’s all you care about. Kenneth Copeland even said in EMIC that the sowing into his ministry to get the big bucks back would work even if you’re not saved. Again, that’s all you vultures care about.
You’ve been warned, and now your blood is not on my hands. The people who have been falsely taught by you and don’t know any better, and also people who do know better but are just rebellious can say whatever they want to, but all of them will learn who the Lord of the church is, and it’s not any man or woman on this earth.
Jesus is the only Lord of this church, and people are going to learn to stop worshiping people and making idols out of them.
You make a living by lying to people, but as Clint Eastwood said, “Dying ain’t no way to make a living.”
You also had better confess every lie and scheme you pulled to make that congregation think I was some kind of a monster. The Lord is absolutely furious with you, and your time is up.
I’ve obeyed the Lord, and your blood is not on my hands.
I don’t have a computer at home so I won’t be on this site often, but I just had to check in on it.
I am going by my inner peace. That still small voice inside. The Holy Spirit of God.
I am far from a perfect person and as of yet I have never walked on water. So not every thought or feeling I may get is 100% pure and should totaly be gone by. But I feel I am hearing from God and doing the right thing.
For a while I listened to people like you, thinking…Well maybe they know a heck of a lot more than me. I HAD NO PEACE ABOUT THAT INSIDE! No endtimes I was not “Afraid”, like a kitten that had bad words spoken about her “idol” or something like that because I feel that is maybe what you perhaps could think about me. And it seemed in your response that maybe I had hit a cord, because you seemed maybe a bit angry, or offended.
Like I said before, God, please forgive me if I would be standing in the way of YOUR work LORD if that is what YOU are doing here. But inside my spirit, I don’t believe it is that.
Gary, do you know 100% sure about their past that it is all lies or does it just SEEM that way to you. Where you there? For example Ken’s father may have been well off but maybe he said, time to find your own way son, become a man, I will not be helping you out.
And as for endtimes The Word says….TEST THE SPIRITS for many spirits have gone out. Something like that it says, I think in Peter.
Gary, I’m not saying your experience is wrong, and thanks for not getting ticked-off at me. That in itself is a good report about you. Walking in love.
But something just isn’t right here. On the surface it looks like the prophecy and the work that is trying to be done here is legitamite. And I do not say that the Copelands are pure as the driven snow. But perhaps God gave them a gift and His gifts may still be at work in them even when they may fall.
I do not inside my spirit feel that the Spirit of God is here at this website and I do not feel that this is God’s way of doing things. Maybe in the old testimate times, but something is not right here. God forgive me please if I am wrong, but I am trying to be led by YOUR SPIRIT and as YOU teach me in YOUR word. YOUR sheep know YOUR VOICE LORD and I just don’t feel that it is here. And If it is, I will stand corrected, let YOUR WILL LORD JESUS AND YOURS ALONE, be done.
Amen.
D a w n S u r v i v o r!
Dawn:
I could not really care less whether you feel an inner peace, a burning, a coldness, or any other sensation – you are depending on spiritual manifestations or mere human emotions (which may or may not be true – but didn’t Jeremiah say the heart is decietful over all things, and just where’s your ‘peace’, in your heart? This is a modern heresy) over the word of God. Why would God’s spirit lead you further when you are so ready to throw the word of God in the Bible aside – that he has already given to you and tells you to follow? The truth is there already yet you ignore it, determined to follow your ‘feelings’ over the written word. You have already quoted a load of unbiblical stuff, and it is clear if you go check your Bible you were totally wrong, yet the truth is, you do not want to believe the truth, and so rationalise the truth away. Hence your ‘feelings’. Follow them if you will, but do not say you follow God in it, for you follow only a god of your own mind and emotions – a cultic god who works in the cults and sects and lives off the flesh and works in quasi leadings. It is this god that led the Shakers astray to dance naked and to commune with the spirits of the dead, and believe their leader Mother Ann Lee was a female Christ – but they were the most zealous bunch of CHRISTIAN folk (albeit led astray) you’ll have ever met. They jerked and twitched just like Toronto and they followed their inner light over the word of God.
The Bible clearly tells you to test the spirits and test the word against the word of God. Numerous cults and sects have gone astray by following manifestations like peace, heat and burning and ending up believing complete nonsense. They were zealous and sincere. Sincerely deluded though and like most who are deluded thought they were bang on target in the truth and were enlightened. Your protection from being led astray is vigorous and continued searching through the Bible.
It was you that said you were ‘afraid’ and I repeat again, your emotions or manifestations are not a true reliable spiritual guide to truth, and your reaction to something is not a guide as to a word’s veracity. People got angry, fearful etc at Jesus and experienced all sorts of negative emotions very far away from ‘peace’, sweetness and light. And some had demonic manifestations. If they had followed their emotions or manifestations alone, then they may have concluded he was from the devil – and some did say that. It is also immaterial what kind of fear you meant as my answer would still be the same to you. I was not angry or offended, I was merely pointing out the obvious and the truth.
Is that not what I say repeatedly throughout this website? So you say it to me, and I say it back to you. If you want to support the Copelands or any other preacher, then test their spirits first properly – not by feelings. Anyone who does this proper testing biblically will come to the same conclusion as this prophecy has. You can believe the prophecy or not. Even put it aside if your emotional response to it is getting you all into a twist and a pickle. Look at the evidence aside from it, if you really do care about truth – and the evidence, the Bible and the Holy Spirit will all testify – ERROR, and we all concur anyway. So who’s false in this case? Just who is leading who astray here?
You keep saying you ‘feel’. It is time to move from feeling to actual knowledge and truth. The truths I point to are from are in the New Testament (not just the OLD), which teach to contend with, rebuke and refute false teachers and false prophets in public. It is really neither here nor there whether there is ‘a bit’ of God’s spirit in them or not. That’s what church discipline is about anyway, correcting God’s children. Judgment starts with the people of God – do you not know this?
If you are sincerely sincere then get your New Testament out, read it and obey it. Don’t try to feign ignorance though and say ‘I am being sincere as my feelings tell me so.’ I warn you that is hypocrisy. If you want to never come back, then fine, so be it, you are welcome to come and go as you see fit. But if you go with one thing ringing in your ears from our conversation it is: read and obey your Bible!
And yes I am angry now, but not at you but the lies in you and others like you. I am angry about the intentional ignorance in today’s church, the hypocrisy, the hero worship, the continual ignoring of the truth, the lack of love for the truth, the delusional minds wanting to be deluded, and the reliance on feelings. I am angry about the apathy, the refusal to correct or rebuke or teach, the refusal to warn. I am angry that so-called followers of Christ refuse to actually follow Him.
Just a small comment about what you said, Joh. You made some good points. A black and white TV was the norm in the mid-’60s. Television shows didn’t even start to change to color until around 1966.
We got our first color TV in 1967, and while we weren’t rich, my dad was a Captain in the Air Force at that time, and we had a good middle class life. Having to watch black and white TV was no big deal at all.
Gospel of John: Jesus: “In this world you will have tribulation.” (John 6:33)
Gospel of Kenneth Copeland (paraphrased): “Mylon LeFevre said if you’re having trouble, you’re not doing it right (living the Christian life).” (Believer’s Voice Television Broadcast – February 17, 2008)
John Hagee explained that well on TV yesterday, I thought. Those who the devil already has, he never bothers to attack.
Hi,
I was not shocked with what God has revealed to you.
I went to a Gloria and kenneth Copeland seminar on the Gold Coast in Queensland Australia a year ago or so and bought a few books and tapes and since have listened to most of them.
While they believe and do have the faith to believe for all things for their lives, i believe they have lost the plot like alot of pastors, ministers, forgetting their role before God and what they should (SHOULD be doing )/
Jesus was in the desert and was tempted by the devil that he could have all the kingdoms of the earth and he rejected them.
When the Disciples followed him, Jesus asked them to leave everything behind.
The rich man was asked to give away it ALL. in order to follow Christ.
I believe this is the principal of really knowing Christ.
Look at Job and what he suffered, through it all he got to know God in a much more better way.
Its putting our total trust in him not our finances, it seems people are believing somehow if they have finances in order, they can tithe more and they will be OK
but what happens when trials come, no amount of money can save one, it’s only Jesus Christ who we call when we need help no one else.
Why is it that we are to renew our minds daily? It’s like a little manner everyday from God, we don’t know it all and are to absolutely rely on him. If we are set financially there is NOthing to Pray about, think about it.
God Bless you
Gary wrote:”Just a small comment about what you said, Joh. You made some good points. A black and white TV was the norm in the mid-’60s”
My point Gary was that the Copelands were indeed doing ok financially at that time rather than the poor ole southern country folk Gloria always goes on about in her “sermons”(AKA begging sessions)Kenneth Could afford Flying lessons why couldnt he afford to buy whining Old Gloria a better TV set???like most of what comes out of the mouths of these people its all a sham to get the crowds thinking(and parting with their $$$)if Gloria can do it why cant i???
On another note here is just a bit more proof of the falseness of these charlatans.. in one of the BVOV log cabbin episodes Kenneth said how Gloria suffered from sleep apnea and had to go to a sleep therapy clinic for “tests” if that was the case… why didnt Gloria Heal herself of this disorder without seeking professional help ?? in another case Kenneth was suffering from a pinched nerve in his back…yet again Kenneth produced scans of the pinched nerve to show the Audience…why didnt Gloria heal him without resorting to professional help or diagnostics? did she not trust her “healing” power???
ive said all i need to
God will deal out their fate in his own way
I just don’t know where to start. I ask the Holy Spirit to guide my words carefully.
I watch the Copeland Ministries daily and I know that they are FAITH driven and Biblically based.
The Lord God does rebuke who He wants. Now if you trully know God’s character, you would know that He would never choose this manner.
In the end times there will be many deceived by deceiving spirits. You have partnered with a deceiving spirit. Please, at least, pray to Jesus that He cleanses any uncleaness and sin that may be in you. Make sure that you partner with God.
I believe you have good intentions. Even the best of intentions can be based on a deception.
What the Copelands AND Gloria preach and stand for is what is Written in the Word by Holy impartation. A person should never try purposefully to cause dissention or strife. That is of the devil not God.
Currently the Lord God Almighty is causing a worldwide impartation of New Blessings, New Beginnings, Mantles and for the people of God to Stand and take Action for His Holy Calling. The devil knows this and is trying vainly to disminish and destroy this anointing on God’s people.
This will never work. God is a just and good God. He will see His people and His Will on earth to its Fullness. Praise God Almighty. Your people, oh God, love and adore you. We praise your Glorious name. We claim Your calling upon our lives. No demonic utterance will cause us to faulter. Your name, Christ Jesus, make the demons scream and flee. Praise You God Almighty. Oh children of Zion, do not be deceived. Call upon you God Almighty and ask of Him what you will.
Glory be to God Almighty!!
And there was me thinking there was just one Holy Spirit and one anointing, with whom we were sealed with at conversion. The apostle John in I John says that those who claim there are extra anointings are liars. Wo do you believe – one who spent his time with Jesus laying his head against his breast, or one who spends much of his time either counting up his money or spending it? Hmm. Tough call that one…
Do not be decieved? Oh I agree, please read your bible and side with the apostle John rather than the new false apostles.
In Love with Jesus- I noticed that you said that those who purposefully cause dissention or strife are being influenced by the devil. I have noticed, in my own experiences and in observing the experiences of others, that those who ask questions or question the theological practices of the charismatic/pentecostal movement are told they are being influenced by the devil because they are questioning and not just believing. I have seen it called a “spirit of religion” and a “spirit of rebellion” if you do not believe/do what the leader of the church says and if you do not submit to their “authority” and “covering”. I can think of many instances in history where it was a good thing to stand up, even when it caused problems. There are tons of Christian martyrs who have been accused of causing dissension because they would not deny their Lord Jesus Christ and submit to the authority over them, who says following Christ is illegal. Is that of the devil too!?! I have been looking at the fruit of this movement in our lives over the last several years, and to be quite honest, it stinks. I still love the Lord and will follow Him, but literally we have been treated better by people “of the world” than by the people in the charismatic/pentecostal circles we have been involved in.
In Love With Jesus,
did you know, that the devil when tempting Jesus, was speaking the ‘word of god’ and was biblebased ? Calling oneself and pretending to be a true believer is the deception which you are not able to discern. We do not know
by their words and their fruits who the Copelands are. Demons as well as men ar very capable to lie and speak the truth through the same spirit they belong to.
The sad fact is, that no men can figure out the deception as long as it is not unmasked by the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ.
What you fancy to feel about the Copelands is certainly not given by the Holy Spirit. It is coming of your heart and reflects only, what you would like to be true.
Are you sure, Jesus KNOWS YOU ?
Well it looks like Copelands “backup plan” Huckabee has all but had it as far as the presidential campaign goes…. now The Copelands are open slather for the wrath of Senator Grassley,s investigations into their corrupt operations .. and given the amount of slanderous remarks Copeland has made toward Grassley id say him his wife and their shonky buisness is going to get torn to shreds and looked at with a fine tooth comb
From Wittenburg Door website:
Now It Gets Interesting
By John Bloom
In the latest dust-up between Senator Charles Grassley’s Televangelism Car Wash and the six “God, Won’t You Buy Me a Mercedes Benz” Ministries, arch resister Kenneth Copeland has finally hit on the correct defense. He recently sent out a letter in which he said that Grassley’s real motivation is to persecute a particular theology, the prosperity gospel. This is both true and false (not that Copeland recognizes the nuance). Grassley is looking at the plain meaning of the Internal Revenue Service code and believes that non-profit money must go primarily for charitable purposes, and those purposes are commonly understood to be for the benefit of classic human needs like food, shelter, relief of sickness, and everything summed up by the word “ministry.” Of course, as we all know, churches have for centuries spent money on luxuries (the marble and gold of St. Peter’s Cathedral, office buildings, real estate, Joel Osteen’s sports arena) without losing their tax exemptions. The difference, in this case, is that Copeland is the world’s foremost spokesman for “Word Faith,” the idea that G-d giving moneyGod has promised material wealth to his chosen people. Since a strict interpretation of the First Amendment would mean that “Word Faith” is neither more valid nor less valid than any other religious belief, the idea of people asking God for money and then receiving money and then spending the money on themselves could be perceived as just another weird American religious sect that needs to be protected from government interference. I think it’s slowly dawning on Copeland that this is the only way he can win, basically selling this idea to a court, knowing that the court will shy away from deciding whether this belief is good or bad, right or wrong. And I hope that’s what he does, because if he tries to sell it to a court, he’ll also end up being forced to sell it in the court of public opinion. Clerics of all faiths will be forced to talk about it. And for the first time in his life, Copeland won’t be able to control where that satellite signal goes.
It seems Kenneth Copeland is making all kinds of threats against Senator Grassley calling him “the Enemy” etc … bad move Ken declaring a standing US government minister the enemy will not only bring you to the attention of the US law enforcement agencies .. it also exposes you more and more as the fraud you are who is trying to create smoke screens to cover your evil doings…Copeland is tearing himself to shreds with all this silly carry on rather than being financially transparent like any REAL church with nothing to hide would be…
Its odd that Gloria hasnt had a single word to say about all this… my thoughts are that she is such a “airhead trophy wife” that she couldnt string any kind of defense together if she tried…(maybe shes dyed her hair once to often and all the chemicals have slowed her cognitive thinking?)Ken is acting like a delusional fool in all this and just exposing himself more each day…in one way its great i guess… it Saves Trinity Foundation and Senator Grassley a lot of work
Dear Brother,
I want to think you for publishing that prophet word to Gloria Copeland. For years I have known that the teachings of this couple were in error, but had not examined them until resently. Was I ever shocked to see that they were not based in the Word of God, but in cultic practices…covered in enough Scripture to make them desirable, and dangerous, to the undiscerning. I am not coming at them pointing a finger, for I have found things in my own life that need changing, but it is my hope that they will repent. I was a pastor in a small town here in Texas…I gave up the ministry…not because I wasn’t called, but I’m not sure to what He has called me to. So have been seeking Him for direction and purpose…knowing that He has called.
His Servant,
Craig
Craig im glad you saw the light regarding the Copelands …unlike so many poor sheep who are still under their curse… i know this blog seems harsh toward them ,but sometimes “shock Value” is the only way people will open their eyes
March 11, 2008
Kenneth and Gloria Copeland
Kenneth Copeland Ministries
14355 Morris Dido Road
Newark, TX 76071
Dear Mr. and Mrs. Copeland:
As senior members of the United States Senate and as Chairman and Ranking Member of the Committee on Finance, it is our duty under the Constitution to conduct oversight into matters related to legislation enacted by Congress. The purpose of oversight is to determine how well a particular agency of the executive branch is administering legislation enacted by Congress, if a particular law or section of the law is being administered in a manner consistent with the intent of Congress and what changes might be required to a law to improve and enhance it. Oversight through the committee system is an important way for Congress to determine if the laws of this country are sound and if they are administered according to the intent of Congress.
One of the roles of the Finance Committee under the Standing Rules of the Senate encompasses the exercise of oversight over the administration of the federal tax revenue system by the Internal Revenue Service to make sure that its rules and procedures meet the purpose and intent of the revenue code, including those rules applicable to non-profit organizations. In order to do this effectively, the Committee needs to understand clearly and specifically how non-profit organizations are structured and operate.
On November 5, 2007, Ranking Member Grassley sent a letter requesting information from your ministry related to the laws that govern tax-exempt organizations. While the inquiry is not part of an enforcement action, which would properly belong to the IRS, it is within the jurisdiction of the Committee to make these inquiries. The Committee conferred with the Senate Legal Counsel to ensure that the letter was well within the scope of the authority of the Committee and that it does not infringe upon First Amendment rights.
Prior to your organization determining whether to submit the requested information, Committee staff members met with your legal counsel to explain the purpose of the investigation and to address your specific concerns. The Committee recognizes the concerns regarding the privacy and confidentiality of certain records and has offered to work with your organization to protect any proprietary or confidential information. Unfortunately, the information submitted by your organization was incomplete. Staff members contacted your legal counsel in an attempt to secure further cooperation and once again address your concerns. To date, you and/or your legal counsel have not provided the requested information to Senator Grassley, nor offered any assurances that the information would be forthcoming.
The Committee continues to hope that mutually respectful discussions will enable the Committee to obtain the requested information without resorting to compulsory process. Therefore, as Chairman and Ranking Member of the Committee on Finance, we are affording you another opportunity to send the information requested by Senator Grassley in the letter dated November 5, 2007. Our office should receive the requested documentation no later than March 31, 2008.
Thank you for your prompt attention to this matter, and we look forward to your cooperation.
Sincerely,
Max Baucus Charles Grassley
Chairman Ranking Member
I hardly ever come to this site anymore because I truely feel that it is not of God. Whether the Copelands are of God or not, I leave that to God to judge and deal with. I take what is WORD and reject what does not seem to line up with GOD’S WORD to the best of my knowledge and with the leading of the HOLY SPIRIT.
I started to read a reply from endtimes to me. I guess she does not believe that the path of wisdom is one of peace or perhaps she does not believe that any one else but her can feel promptings of the HOLY SPIRIT, because she acted like I should be dismissed because she thinks I get lead by goose bumps or some cold chill or some other nonsense like that.
I didn’t even waste my time after reading the 1st few sentences to read the rest. Lord Jesus forgive me if I am wrong, I do not claim to know all things, but I also don’t want to be someone who seems to get off on strife, and by attempting to gain a following of the internet.
I in the very act of typing this can see I am participating in this strife and strife is not of God!
Bottom line is I do not believe that this prophecy website is of God…….Boy this website sure has much to say about many, many things and people. Check out all of the other topics offered. You “prophets” seem to be God’s appointed butt kickers, aren’t you? Yes, in the Old Testimate God was brutal and to the point. I just don’t see the Spirit of God in all of this, like my opinion or not, I answer to the Lord Jesus and not to you.
Finally the ball has started rolling …now the Senate is backing Sen Grassley on this investigation it may open some doors and shed some light on the spending practices of these frauds… personally i hope Kenneth and Gloria along with their son John are prosecuted for ripping off the flock and publicly shamed by doing some prison time….but it remains to be seen exactly what lays in store for these evil people…at the very least their tax exempt status should be revoked and them made to pay back taxes on their lifestyle…they are both elderly so this might end up being the case… but Gloria is only 66 so prison may be an option..
KENNETH HAGIN’s FORGOTTEN WARNING
-by J. Lee Grady.
Before he died in 2003, the revered father of the Word-Faith
movement corrected his spiritual sons for going to extremes with
their message of prosperity.
Charismatic Bible teacher Kenneth Hagin Sr. is considered the
father of the so-called prosperity gospel. The folksy, self-trained
“Dad Hagin” started a grass-roots movement in Oklahoma that
produced a Bible college and a crop of famous preachers
including Kenneth Copeland, Jerry Savelle, Charles Capps, Jesse
DuPlantis, Creflo Dollar and dozens of others—all of whom teach
that Christians who give generously should expect financial
rewards on this side of heaven.
Hagin taught that God was not glorified by poverty and that
preachers do not have to be poor. But before he died in 2003 and
left his Rhema Bible Training Center in the hands of his son,
Kenneth Hagin Jr., he summoned many of his colleagues to Tulsa
to rebuke them for distorting his message. He was not happy that
some of his followers were manipulating the Bible to support what
he viewed as greed and selfish indulgence. Those who were close
to Hagin Sr. say he was passionate about correcting these abuses
before he died. In fact, he wrote a brutally honest book to address
his concerns. The Midas Touch was published in 2000, a year
after the infamous Tulsa meeting.
Many Word-Faith ministers ignored the book. But in light of the
recent controversy over prosperity doctrines, it might be a good
idea to dust it off and read it again.
Here are a few of the points Hagin made in The Midas Touch:
1. Financial prosperity is not a sign of God’s blessing. Hagin wrote:
“If wealth alone were a sign of spirituality, then drug traffickers and
crime bosses would be spiritual giants. Material wealth can be
connected to the blessings of God or it can be totally disconnected
from the blessings of God.”
2. People should never give in order to get. Hagin was critical of
those who “try to make the offering plate some kind of heavenly
vending machine.” He denounced those who link giving to getting,
especially those who give cars to get new cars or who give suits
to get new suits. He wrote: “There is no spiritual formula to sow a
Ford and reap a Mercedes.”
3. It is not biblical to “name your seed” in an offering. Hagin was
horrified by this practice, which was popularized in faith
conferences during the 1980s. Faith preachers sometimes tell
donors that when they give in an offering they should claim a
specific benefit to get a blessing in return. Hagin rejected this idea
and said that focusing on what you are going to receive “corrupts
the very attitude of our giving nature.”
4. The “hundredfold return” is not a biblical concept. Hagin did the
math and figured out that if this bizarre notion were true, “we would
have Christians walking around with not billions or trillions of
dollars, but quadrillions of dollars!” He rejected the popular teaching
that a believer should claim a specific monetary payback rate.
5. Preachers who claim to have a “debt-breaking” anointing should
not be trusted. Hagin was perplexed by ministers who promise
“supernatural debt cancellation” to those who give in certain
offerings. He wrote in The Midas Touch: “There is not one bit of
Scripture I know about that validates such a practice. I’m afraid it
is simply a scheme to raise money for the preacher, and
ultimately it can turn out to be dangerous and destructive for all
involved.”
(Many evangelists who appear on Christian television today use
this bogus claim. Usually they insist that the miraculous debt
cancellation will occur only if a person “gives right now,” as if the
anointing for this miracle suddenly evaporates after the prime time
viewing hour. This manipulative claim is more akin to witchcraft
than Christian belief.)
Hagin condemned other hairbrained gimmicks designed to trick
audiences into emptying their wallets. He was especially incensed
when a preacher told his radio listeners that he would take their
prayer requests to Jesus’ empty tomb in Jerusalem and pray over
them there—if donors included a special love gift. “What that radio
preacher really wanted was more people to send in offerings,”
Hagin wrote.
Thanks to the recent resurgence in bizarre donation schemes
promoted by American charismatics, the prosperity gospel is back
under the nation’s microscope. It’s time to revisit Hagin’s concerns
and find a biblical balance.
Hagin told his followers: “Overemphasizing or adding to what the
Bible actually teaches invariably does more harm than good.” If the
man who pioneered the modern concept of biblical prosperity blew
the whistle on his own movement, wouldn’t it make sense for us to
listen to his admonition?
~J. Lee Grady is editor of Charisma. The Midas Touch is available
from Kenneth Hagin Ministries at- http://www.rhema.org
~SOURCE: http://www.charismamag.com/fireinmybones/
Here is evidence of Kennith Hagin plagiarizing the works of E. W. Kenyon and claiming them as his own. There are side by side comparisons from the writings of both men as evidence. http://intotruth.org/wof/kenyon.html
Dawn…. thats your democratic right to question what you dont wish to believe in
But we(the posters) in here are not the ones making the prophecies ..we are merely adding our thoughts on this matter
peace be with you my friend
Joh, thanks for your smiley faces and kindness to how I feel. Peace to you also.
I’m not saying the Copelands are without fault. I would never say we are not to question preachers. Only cults say don’t question. I also am repenting for being a part of strife because I can see how I get on this site at times.
I fought hard to find out where I stand in what I believe. It is a process. Working out your own salvation as the word says.
The “prophecy” of little Mrs. Endtimes seems so like God speaking because I see simularities with how He speaks to me. I also see that little Mrs. Endtimes seems to imply that she feels like others don’t clearly hear His voice. I feel she is smug and self-righteous, copelands and all aside. I feel there is arrogance on this site because it seems like all of these “prophets” seem to feel that they have been appointed by God to POINT OUT EVERYONE’S FAULTS AND FAILURES. It seems like a load of CONDEMNATION is found here. ***O yea, I forget, she basically made me feel like she thinks I am some OVERLY EMOTIONAL CHILD who goes by goosebumps type feelings*** The Lord’s sheep hear his voice lady! Not just you, if you realy do! Yes, you may know the WORD, maybe inside and out and even better than me, BUT SO DID THE DEVIL KNOW THE WORD! He spoke it to Jesus durring the temptation!
Like I said months ago before the atmosphere of this site provoked me to strife, and no little Mrs. Endtimes, little Mrs. “Iv’e got all the answers and DAWN must just have heard something that she didn’t want to hear”. WRONG, Mrs. self-righteous accuser who believes that God appointed her to bring everybody down like he can’t do so Himself WITHOUT all of this strife of tongues where in the multitude of words sin is NOT lacking……..Like I said months ago, IF THIS “PROPHECY” IS OF GOD, SPEAK IT OUT AS YOU DID, AND SAY IF THIS IS TRUELY OF THE LORD ABOUT THE COPELANDS, AND I TRUELY AM A PROPHET OF GOD, THESE WORDS WILL COME TO PASS ON THEIR OWN WITH OUT ME BLOGGING IN DEFENSE OF IT!!!! AND IF THIS IS OF SOME SPIRIT OF DECEPTION, THESE WORDS WILL FALL TO THE GROUND, LET THE LORD BE MAGNIFIED! AMEN!
CASE CLOSED!
Is this of the Lord! Does this site match with Phillipians 4:8?
Does all of this realy set the captives free!
Like I said…..TRUST IN THE LORD! Be thankfull for any TRUE WORD OF GOD, a preacher preaches and when the Holy Spirit says….”Now that part is not of ME”, disgard it! Follow the Lord’s direction and ask for His Wisdom! Little Mrs. Endtimes is not needed by any of us! Great if the “Prophecy” is truely of God, great, thanks for being obedient. But as I see more and more of this site….I do not believe this is of the Lord.
Now all you who like crucifying others, continue to come here.
The only one that did me any good in being crucified was Jesus. How about you? What are you critical people getting out of all of this kind of crucifying of others.
Surely you have enough sense to spit out the pits when you are eating a water mellon! Do that with every one who preaches, they are human, and do that also with Endtimes. This is not the old testimate, we have the word and His Spirit now.
DAWN SURVIVOR
Dawn you question our “rights” to defend against false prophets?and expose them to whoever chooses to read this blog?The bible itself says to expose the false prophets does it not?ok maybe some of the remarks about the Copelands are over the top.. (mine included) but bear in mind the amount of damage to peoples lives these heretics have caused over the years??
People have lost touch and faith in the lord because of the damage to the scripture the Copelands have done… and on and on etc
Not to mention their outlandish lifestyle they live by “stealing” from their flock to support it… ok i understand your pride is hurt by accusations etc but you yourself said you only need to follow and listen to the one true teacher??
peace be with you Dawn
Dawn, Dawn, Dawn,
Why do you feel the emotional need to defend teachings that are false false false? And deceptive. Forget the Copelands for a second. Don’t you feel a righteous anger when teachers and preachers teach things that are false? Doesn’t that bother you? Righteous anger is not a bad thing. If Miriam (Endtimes) came off as arrogant maybe it’s because she feels that righteous anger and desires to see that the sheep identifiy the wolves.
Do you think you are a little god on earth? Do you dare to tell people that you are on equal ground with God? Isn’t that the same lie that Satan told Eve in the Garden-that she could become like God?
Kennith Copeland believes that. So isn’t Satan using him as a false teacher? Is that ok? Is that just a little error or a full blown lie of the devil?
JOH, I do not know what you mean by my pride being hurt. It is not. I’m not to be pridefull anyway, but to humble myself before God.
I guess MY big question is HOW DO WE KNOW WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT THE COPELANDS ARE 100% HERETIC? DO WE KNOW 100% THAT THEY “ON PURPOSE” ARE JUST WANTING $$$$$MONEY AND EMPIRE AND INFLUENCE AND THAT ALL OF THEIR PERSONAL STORIES ARE EMBELLISHED HOG WASH???
Yes, me and you may see things different ways perhaps as in doctornal differences, but as for the Copelands can I or you or the NEWS MEDIA who are mostly unsaved be in any position to stand in judgement of another persons heart before the Lord??? That is why I say take the fruit and spit out the pits, no man is perfect, and neither I or you or endtimes can judge them.
How do we KNOW 100% what the NEWS MEDIA put forth as news is NOT embellished?
I have questions! Look at my prior blogs you will see the process I went through. My questions started out AGAINST THEM–LIKE HOW DARE THEY!!!
Then my questions became–Well, do I know the truth about the flight logs? Do I know if the piolits needed rest, or the plain to refuel and perhaps they put it down where they can get rest, and yes maybe a little fun, and perhaps meet up with some friends that where in need or prayer or just some people where they all encourage eachother in their like faith!!
Are some of us just jelous that they have a qood quality of life? You know they write books and put out music tapes and such so WHY DON’T YOU NAME FOR ME SOME AUTHORS WHO DON’T RECEIVE WEALTH OF OF THE BOOKS THEY WRITE OR THE MUSIC THEY MAKE?
Isn’t there a verse, in Ps or Provbers that states…”LET THE LORD BE MAGNIFIED WHO HAS PLEASURE IN THE PROSPERITY OF HIS SERVANT?”
I have an alert for all of you….***ALERT***ALERT***
Have any of you heard of the NEW WORLD ORDER? How Bush Senior called for it in one of his speaches? How many of these ungodly men believe in killing the dollar like it’s being done now, and bring forth an ungodly GLOBAL GOVERNMENT, to bring all together that which the Lord saw them trying to do at the tower of Babel?
I bring that all up becasue of this……In government documents, they mention, THEY ARE RECRUITING PREACHERS TO CALM THEIR FLOCKS AND ORDER THEM TO DO WHATEVER THE GOVERNMENT TELLS THEM TO DO, AND TELLING THEM TO SAY THAT BASED ON WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS WE ARE ALL TO SUBMIT TO THE WILL OF GOVERNMENT. Does that mean taking a mark in our hands or foreheads when the get all on curency?
I bring this up because…..MAYBE SOME PREACHERS DECIDED NOT TO GO ALONG WITH THIS and now it is time to make them look so evil, that everyone falls away from them.
Type into a search engine GOVERNMENT RECRUITS PREACHERS.
I do not believe “give $$ to the preachers till it hurts”.
I do believe in the tithe and have seen miricles in my life!
I’ll share one of the small ones. I tithed, very little. I didn’t have a job. I decided to get my free tire rotation I had comming to me. I NEEDED so many more things. I dropped off my car, and walked to the mall, and came back to find they told me they “made a mistake”. They gave me tire rotation, tire ballance, allignment, and oil change! Before I had a moment to scream….I CAN’T PAY YOU FOR THAT!!!! They said NO CHARGE, we mixed-up your car with someone else’s. NO CHARGE. I left and cried. I was so thank full!
I could tell you so many other beautiful stories to the glory of God. But I don’t know you, and I am not going to cast my pearls,(what is precious to me) before people I don’t know.
What I am saying is maybe you don’t believe the word about God opening the windows of heaven and pouring out a blessing when you tithe, but I do believe!
Even if the copelands would be heretic, that part that is the true Word of God comming out of them, isn’t, and I will obey that word even if you are believing that all of the preachers and just preaching it as a get rich quick scam!!
And as for Gary the guy who claims he had to hide out in a budist monestary to get away from the Copelands….Well, maybe it is ALL TRUE, and maybe he is a couple frys short in his happy meal too!
Question: Are you and endtimes God appointed or self appointed “false prophet exposers”?
Yes people have been hurt by false preachers or just simply misquided ones. I know someone who went to a church that taught and believed that women had to always wear a head covering and that every body needed deliverence to get the demons that came into their souls while they where being raised in ungodly homes cast out of them. A demon was behind every corner with these people and a womans ONLY value was to cook, clean, reproduce.
That screwed her up. She started to resent God.***BUT*** She kept seeking Him. She got healing. Things changed. God is now loved by her. No, no false preacher busters came into her life to rescue her. No Mrs. endtimes showed-up with a blog. She worked-out her own salvation, through prayer, and reading, and THE LORD’S LEADING HER….not by any hero on a white blog if you know what I mean.
Give the Children of God more credit than you do, and give the Lord Jesus who loves us and will not allow any one to snatch us out of HIS hands more credit than you do!
DAWN SURVIVOR
Just one last thing……I guess the thing that just realy gets me going is I see all of the other so called posts. Who are these people to JUDGE others when they are not with them 100% of the day and night and behind closed doors? Did God appoint you all watch dogs or is it something in you? I just wonder if you Joh, and you endtimes, and you Gary where blessed to be on T.V. to get out what you believe is God’s Word…..how many people would crop up and find accusations and things about your past perhaps or things that where taken out of context or just plain simple mis-understandings about the Word that years latter you may see you where not totally correct about just as an excuse to throw daggers and you?
Just currious.
Remember the verses about the speck in your brothers eye and don’t judge unless you are wanting to be judged.
Just a sugjestion.
Does this website line up with Phillippians 4:8 in your opinion?
DAWN SURVIVOR
Dawn:
Nobody said that the Copelands were ‘100% heretics’. If you look at what I and others say, it is that there is truth mingled in with error – a lot of error in the Copelands’ case – but it does not make everything they’ve ever said or done to be false. That’s the nature of false teachers and prophets – don’t you know this? That’s why they’re so dangerous. A little leaven goes through the whole batch. And then when you add to that leaven, making merchandise off the Saints it gets even worse.
Dawn:
You obviously have deep seated and pre-existing issues – that have nothing at all to do with me – because of the way you’ve bitten back and all the sarcasm towards me.
You say: ‘no man is perfect, and neither I or you or endtimes can judge them’ …yet you’ve harshly judged ME as ‘false’, ‘proud’, ‘arrogant’, ‘claming to be the only one who can hear God’, ’smug’, and trying to be ’some hero’ and after a ‘following’ and even ‘Satanic inspired’ for merely speaking out the TRUTH and following biblical guidelines re exposing wolves. Even if what you said about me is true (it’s not, and obviously not true to anyone who reads what I say with an open mind), then isn’t that contradictory and hypocritical even by YOUR own (false) plumbline as you claim you have no right to judge? So what are you doing judging me, if this is really the case?
What’s the real issue here? What I’ve said has obviously hit a raw nerve in you. Examine that raw nerve closely, as it will be the key to setting you free. Perhaps it’s you don’t like being decieved and admitting you’ve been ‘had’ and been taken advantage of and manipulated against your will – huh? Nobody does – which is why many stay self deluded, instead supporting and defending the ones who have hurt them rather than admit the horrendous truth to themselves which is too painful for them to bear – and so they make excuses instead and try to justify the bad behaviour or pretend it does not exist just like you’re doing now. People like this often attack the messenger: eg the cheated-on wife who will attack the neigbour who says of her errant husband: ‘he’s lying to you. love’, even when she knows it’s the truth. Its human nature. Admitting you’ve been conned or decieved or your basis for your faith is based on a lot of lies hits all sorts of other deep seated hurts and anger from the past as to how you percieved people used you or decieved you etc. No wonder you’re so sore inside.
You also imply that nobody needs anybody exposing false teaching for them as ‘God will keep them safe from it’, and one can get by by being led in their own way by the Lord. Apart from the unbiblical nature of this claim – let’s all throw away teachers, preachers, evangelists, watchmen and prophets and do it all yourself as they’re not needed – and the disregard for the need for the Body and its functions and other parts – then why then do you listen to the Copelands if you don’t need others’ guidance or input? One rule for them (whose ear tickling words you like) and another rule for those you don’t like to hear , huh?
BTW: if you think tithing ‘works’, why don’t you bless a more worthy ministry than the Copelands with your money?
> ‘Blessed’ to be on TV?!
Are you really that naive Dawn? Do you really think God has anything to do with most ‘Christian’ TV nowadays? You have to be a heretic to even be shown on the God Channel now.
If I were really after the fame, following and adulation you claim I am, Dawn, I’d sell out and compromise – I’d change my tune and speak like all their false prophets and teachers and speak ear tickling words. I’d make merchandise of the Saints and twist teachings about tithing and seeds for my own and/or the TV station’s financial benefit. It’s far easier to get by in the church by being a heritic. I’d certainly be far more rich, popular and famous and less criticised than I am now. My back would not have been almost ripped apart by injuries sustained in speaking the truth – it would have been heartily slapped instead. But I refuse to compromise as it is God I serve and please, not man. MOST people in the Charismatic church are full of the same sort of theological garbage as you are, and attack people such as me who speak the truth, so I’m unlikely to ever be popular with the religious people of my day. But no biblical prophet ever was popular either. Who do you think persecuted the prophets? It wasn’t from outside the ‘church’ by the heathen it was from inside by the religious, it was the religious that persecuted and killed the prophets, not the heathen!
‘Recently, Time magazine explored the popularity of “prosperity theology,” a movement that goes by various other names, too: “word of faith,” “health and wealth” or “name it and claim it.”
I have more than a passing interest in this theology.
I hold it partly responsible for my wife’s death.
Time highlighted pastors Joel Osteen, T.D. Jakes and Creflo Dollar as prosperity theology’s most visible spokesmen. It focused on their belief in material riches.
However, although Time didn’t say so, divine healing is another core tenet of this system — thus the alternate name, health and wealth.
I’ve heard Osteen, to cite one example, preach about his mother’s recovery from advanced cancer, which he attributes to her unwavering faith. When my wife, Renee, was sick, she read Dodie Osteen’s book Healed of Cancer.
In any case, Joel Osteen, Jakes and Dollar are only three representatives of a much larger movement. Many lesser-known ministers preach prosperity theology. The details of their teachings vary — and some are far more radical than Osteen, Jakes or Dollar.
Generally, prosperity theology says that whatever happens to us is the result of our personal faith in God, or lack thereof. If we exhibit enough faith, God gives us what we want, whether it’s a Harley motorcycle or a miraculous healing from AIDS.
Prosperity preachers demand that Christians maintain stratospherically high levels of faith, what I’d describe as super-faith. They insist that Christians speak only positive words; negative words are symptoms of doubt.
You might get attacked by a “spirit of poverty,” the preachers say, a demonic spirit that wants to keep you poor. But if you stand firm by refusing to admit you’re poor, and if you have enough faith (and, too often, if you send that particular minister a sizable offering), God is obligated, by his biblical promises, to make you wealthy.
Likewise, you might get attacked by sickness. But if you flex your faith enough, and continually tell everyone you’re well, God absolutely must heal you, every time.
The subtext is clear: If you’re not healthy or wealthy, you’re a weak Christian. It’s your own fault you’re suffering — you don’t believe what God said.
In late 1996 or early 1997, Renee found a lump in her left breast.
Years before, she’d started watching, then ordering audio- and videotapes from TV preachers Kenneth and Gloria Copeland, mainstays of the prosperity movement. She followed other prosperity preachers as well, but the Copelands were her favorites.
I enjoyed hearing them myself. I used some of their points in my own sermons. Renee and I had traveled to one of the Copelands’ huge rallies in Texas and were edified.
But I didn’t accept the prosperity message nearly to the extent Renee did.
To me, there were elements of truth in what super-faith preachers taught. Many of us do hamstring ourselves by being too negative in our thoughts, by selling God short.
Still, I didn’t think faith was a magic wand with which you could ward off life’s vicissitudes. The idea that believers can always escape poverty and sickness not only violates Christ’s teachings, it violates 2,000 years of Christian history and all of Christian experience. It violates common sense.
After all, Jesus was crucified. St. Peter said, “Silver and gold have I none.” St. Paul bemoaned his bodily ailments and those of his fellow missionaries.
When Renee found that lump, she decided she could overcome it through faith. She would pray for her breast and proclaim that she was healed. God had to deliver her, she believed.
God wants us to have faith, I argued, but he also gave us brains and intended us to use them. Sure, we should pray, I said. But get medical help, too.
She said I was walking in “doubt and unbelief,” a prosperity gospel catch-phrase.
She wouldn’t see a doctor — for three years. By then, the cancer had spread to both her breasts, her lungs, her bones and her liver. It was incurable.
For five more years, she talked about the awesome testimony she would have when God healed her. Daily she watched the Copelands, Dollar or Osteen on TV, or listened to their tapes. She enrolled in correspondence courses on divine healing.
We couldn’t even discuss our situation honestly, because Renee thought it was heresy to admit she might not get well. It was maddening.
I don’t blame the prosperity preachers totally for Renee’s death.
It’s not their fault she got cancer. And, to be fair, prosperity ministers don’t explicitly instruct Christians to refuse medical treatment.
Nevertheless, having listened to hundreds of prosperity sermons, I think Renee’s reactions were predictable. The health-and-wealth gospel’s foundational message is this: Faith is all you need. It’s very seductive.
But God isn’t a cosmic ATM hooked to a bottomless bank account. You don’t feed him your password — a few pet Scriptures, the right prayer incantation — and withdraw heaping stacks of $50 bills. Neither does God grant you a miraculous cure any time you want it. Maybe it was God who gave us doctors and science.
An old adage reminds us that if something sounds too good to be true, it probably is. That’s the case with health-and-wealth theology.
It sounds too good to be true because, mostly, it is.
In extreme cases, it can even prove deadly.’
Paul Prather in Lexington Herald-Leader, Oct. 14, 2006
That’s a sad story and I’m sorry to hear it. I’ve heard too many like it before. I’ve heard Joel Olsteen talk about his mother’s miraculous healing of cancer and I’ve also heard him talk very openly about how his mother took traditional medical care when she needed hip replacement. There is a time and place for both, May God grant us the wisdom and humility to know when.
There is alot of nonsense out there, some of it is very costly. I don’t know enough about these televangilist like the Copelands to defend or accuse them. Quite frankly I really don’t care. So however bizarre the behaviour or whatever kooky website some smiley faced blogger wants to dig up none of this negates the fact that there is a Biblical prosperity for God’s people as well as a Biblical basis for being in sound health. There is also a perfectly good explanation for why some people get healed immediately and some get healed over time and some never get healed at all. And the answere is … I don’t know. And I don’t trust any one who says he does.
The Bible is sure and steadfast and it tells us many things to expect in this life as God’s people. It says that we can expect to be disciplined for disobedience, we can be tested in our faith even when we are obedient, we might even be imprisoned or tortured for our faith. We are strongly admonished to take up our cross and bear it. But the Bible also clearly says that we can expect to prosper and be in good health as His people in this life and that we can live a life of overcomming. Let’s not loose site of either as we see this crazy circus act unfold before us.
The article by Paul Prather is well written and balanced. There is no bitterness here, but simple truth. The teaching of the Copelands, particularly concerning health/healing, has warped my brother-in-laws thinking to such an extent that he blames my sister for her ill health(she has had a hysterectomy and lost a kidney through endometriosis, and was in intensive care with septicaemia).The fact that the rest of the family believe we saw God bring her back from the brink in answer to our prayers means little to him because he thinks she should say she is well, even when she clearly is not(sort of Scientology style). This kind of thinking causes so much heartache, and makes me very angry.
Comment 213 by Temple. You express clearly and concisely what is a touch issue. Yesterday (3/17) I had my second knee operation. There was absolutely nothing wrong with my faith that God could heal me immediatley or over a process of time. However, after hobbling around for 5 months on a swollen painful knee I capitulated and had an operation which has now left me pain free and fully mobile. That was the end of August 2007. Four months later my other knee went the same way. I thought I had a second chance to believe God again for a miracle ‘healing’. After two months I knew that this wasn’t God’s way (for HIS OWN REASON) I was pleading Him for an explanation. None came. In the early hours of the morning of my op, I was wokened with the words of the song “This is the day THAT THE LORD HAS MADE. I will rejoice and be glad in it”. I haven’t sung that song for years and haven’t consciously thought of that Scripture (Phillipians) anytime recent. I went back to sleep KNOWING that this day was made by God, that He knew and allowed everything concerning me and my troublesome knees to be exactly as it would be. It was at that point that my faith was once again tried and tested. I can believe Him to heal me can I still believe in Him, Love Him and Trust Him when He won’t heal me miracuously? Operations are not pleasant, pre-op and post-op. They are time consuming, costly and interfere with the routine of our demanding schedules, put family members and their needs on hold while recovery takes place. Yet our loving and all wise Father lets it be that way. Don’t lose faith He knows what He is doing. Whatever your circumstances, Keep looking to Him.
Hey there TEMPLE, ELIZABETH, SHOSHANA, AND PAUL PRATHER if he is listening too,……I take your words to heart! So far this place just appeared to me to be a place for a stoneing! You know, like for the woman caught in adultery.
Your words are rational, and reasonable to me.
Like I said, this place felt like a stoneing of the Copelands, who if it wasn’t for them, I would not even know that God may even perhaps want to heal or want to prosper me. I knew that He may want to kick my butt if I would do wrong, and I have seen things that would make Him appear to be mean and cruel; but through the Copelands drawing my attention to verses in the bible I never knew exhisted, I came to know God in a beautiful light. No, He is not as a monkey on a string where I say such and such and it HAS TO BE. I recognize the need for balance here to. But it seems if it was left up to some people, like the way endtimes lady appears to be, God would be put across as scary, demanding, going to get you, cruel, not caring if you are desperate to pay your bills or weak, sick or hurting. Maybe endtimes really isn’t that way, but like I said, this whole site seems to be a good place for a stoneing!
Just one other quick thing and then I think I am done with this site, kinda sorry about comming down on endtimes, but then again…..the stoneing thing and all..
Well, there are so many Athiests trying their best to get God out of everything…..so, what I am trying to say is..howmany of these stories about people trying to stand on the Word of God, who supposedly didn’t get healed and died horribly, are realy researched and varified to be true? They may be, but what if people who have a bone to pick with God are making a lot of things up so as to say…”Go home Christians, there is nothing to see here in this standing on the Word of God stuff, you won’t be healed, ect….”.
And as for Miss. Endtimes, It may seem I have treated her horribly, but If you read our past exchanges, she seems to give off this air about her, like she is the only one who could be hearing from God and anyone else who thinks they do may just be misguided fools. And she seems to be defending all of her beliefs. I thought we all came here because of this “prophecy”, and like I said, if it is of God it needs absolutely no defense. Just say, I feel it is of the Lord, I was obedient, I leave it up to God now. But it seems she is here to prove her points, and not just say I feel this is of the Lord so I put it on the World Wide Web for the body of Christs’ consideration….and leave it at that!
Her real name sounds realy Jewish. God bless those who are, don’t get me wrong on that! But maybe there is some bias here! How do we realy know just what she acutally believes? Do you know? Have you met her, know her true background? Maybe there is some Christian bias, or maybe it is a scam, or maybe she has a demon, or maybe she is part of some sect.
What church do you go to Miss. Endtimes?
Where is it?
Who is the pastor of it and how can he be reached for comment?
What is your denomination?
What do they believe and how do they go about things?
What kind of leadership do you submit to as is lined up in the word of God….Pastors, Bishops, ect…..
Are you just a lone wolf?
These are good questions, do not dismiss any of them.
What is your background? I know I once read what you say you stand for….BUT CAN YOUR STORY BE VARRIFIED!?
Who is it truely that we are listening to, who stands up claiming to speak for God??????????
What may be your TRUE agenda?
At 1st I asked questions of you inside myself kinda like….boy don’t want to say anything bad about one who is the prophet of God!!!
But now I bear in mind that I have the Lord’s Spirit inside me! I know I do! I am saved! And this is not the old testimate where only a choosen few have His spirit and His guidence!
Praise God!
And everytime I mention to you that I have HIS Word, and His Spirit and don’t need you for guidence that He will lead me……well…..I’ve read your response…..you act like I am lead by goosebumps or cold chills or that I am emotional or something.
Let’s just leave it at that for now.
Yeah, that’s right Dawn, that’s really logical – I’m part of a Jewish conspiracy plot, and I’m also a scammer and in a sect.
My mission is to expose false teachers and to speak the truth from the word of God which does make me as of the few and far between nowadays – as if I were in a sect as I am certainly in the minority, and often my voice is the lone voice among heretics and ear ticklers – so often I am as a lone voice in the wilderness about me and am not popular with the religious majority. As I have never asked for one penny or recieved one penny for prophesying to date, and refuse to even have click through ads on this blog so as to not make money from God’s word, my ’scam’ hasn’t been very successful to date though….and my conspiracy to get people to go Jewish isn’t very successful when I speak against Judaisers, Zionism, pseudo prophetism Chuck Pierce style with Jewish dates etc, and extol grace instead of the law. Now I realise what I’m doing wrong! I should stop speaking the truth then my conspiracy would go better.
** *
I do not say here that God does not heal. If you got off your high horse, you’d read on this blog how I’ve been miraculously healed and believe in healing and true miracles and signs and wonders. However there’s also the counterfeit and charlatans to be aware of – and people need warned about false teaching etc.
Nobody is saying don’t stand on the word of God – what we’re saying is don’t stand on the distorted word of God from false preachers and charlatans like the Copelands. The true word of God one should stand on involves rebuking and exposing false teachers and charlatans – but you don’t like that bit, Dawn – so what’s really got your goat? It’s not what you’ve said it is, you haven’t been honest with yourself or others yet about why you’re reacting so venomously. Give it time, then, perhaps you’ll see.
Nope, that’s what you percieve in your anger because you don’t like what I say, and because I dare to say people are wrong when they are wrong. How arrogant of me! How cultic! But how biblical. Plenty of other people can hear God too – including you. (But no man is an island – we all need the body, you cannot rely on your own knowledge and be unteachable from other human beings though you must test and weigh everything you are taught.)
I don’t need to prove any of the prophecies – they will stand and fall on their own merit. However, we’re not discussing the prophecy, we’re discussing me here. And also for the sake of those interested, I make myself more accessible and more human and do expand and give greater detailed information or just generally have a chat as to points raised. That’s what blogs are for.
Er… you read it on here, and decide whether or not you believe me. The rest of the questions you asked are all answered on this blog, Dawn.
If you have His word, then follow it and don’t knock others for following it. Over and out.
Dawn Survivor, I agree that it is hard to read so much negative stuff about people, particularly if they are those you respect and whose ministry has been a blessing. However, I think you are being unfair to Miriam in accusing her of such bias (your comment about sounding Jewish made me cringe). She clearly loves God, has concern for the body of Christ, and has an unpopular message to deliver. I have had a problem in the past with Christians who have been cruel and insensitive whilst claiming to ’speak the truth in love’. But I do believe that in Miriams case, she might just be speaking the truth for the right reasons.
Dawn i have just one thing to add to all this in Miriams Defense … Miriam has never once said SHE is a god… yet the Copelands have on many occasions…. think about it my friend
Peace be with you
Miriam,
I believe somewhere back in the comments you mentioned you were in the UK?
Just thought i would let you know that…April 17th to 19th the Copelands will be at the Bournemouth International Center Bournemouth UK for meetings.. and for anyone in Europe they will be at the Exhibition buildings in Basel Switzerland on the 24th to 26th of April… if your near there maybe worth going along to checkout for yourself just what we are trying to say about these people??Maybe you could take some photos of the miraculous healing,s?? and post them here
Bottom line for me is this.
If I have been wrong, unjust, or unsensitive I believe and know and ask God to correct me and He will. Not by wacking me over the head or via car wreck or cancer, but by His Spirit and His Word.
I still have things to learn and you know something…..
That is OK!
In time, God may change my veiw, but flesh will not.
I do not think that Copeland said we are God, JOH. Maybe there was a misunderstanding. I do know that in the Hebrew language (original texts and such) maybe there was more meaning to something that was said. We are created in His image. Maybe what was said in some way pertained to that, because I have more sense than to think I am God! But I am created in His image and believe His Spirit resides within me.
Besides……that’s one thing that I don’t get.
If you don’t trust what a man preaches…..what the heck are you spending your time listening to him? Don’t you have something better to do, like go out and comfort the sick and witness? Or don’t you believe in that?
I believe God will deal with false prophets and His sheep know His voice and will realize when a false shepherd is among them. It is those who are not saved that I have a concern about being cheated. But God is in control and those who seek Him I do believe find Him. Or would you call Him a liar? For I fully believe that! Now if they are just seeking the gift and not the giver….well….
Elizabeth…Really sorry I made you cringe. I feel a good heart about you. I just get this feeling about God’s love really being near you. I just feel like shouting out…”Good greetings highly favored and loved one!” Something tells me you may know why. I don’t imparticularly. Accept that God does love us.
But I am not one of the ones who say…..now, I’m just speaking the truth in love….as they make you feel sick to your stomache in just their very presence being near! So I know what you mean.
What I ment yesterday is….there are so many people who are wolves in sheeps clothing, but they have alterier motives. And in life I have come to see that the ones who point the finger at others the most are the ones you are to be RUNNING FROM!!!!
I just do not feel life here. Just death. Accept for Some like you. Mostly, I feel a which hunt. That is why I guess there are not many here to stand up and say…Yes, I was healed or yes I was delivered! Either,
A. They want to stay out of strife.
B. They are afraid to examine their faith or have it challenged.
So the minute they start seeing the “prophecy” they say the heck with this!
Elizabeth, I know of a Jewish rabbi who accepted Jesus that I just love! I love knowing of the Jewish tradition. I see God in that! So maybe you thought of me something that isn’t true.
Jesus was Jewish. Jesus went to synagog and wore prayer shalls and I respect Jewish people!
But there are wolves in sheeps clothing, even in the early church of the bible where those still with one foot in the Jewish tradition tried to get the early christians away from the faith. That is all I was implying about Miriam. That neither I or you may realy know what is in her heart.
In case you where not able to tell, I do not read her replys to me anymore. Not because it is something I don’t want to hear….if I was afraid of my faith being challenged I would never have come here in the 1st place! But I don’t read her replys because like I said, I do not believe she has been sent of God. If she did not have a dagger to twist, she would not be doing things as she has been doing.
She would say,
“Body of Christ, I believe this prophecy has been given to me by God and I humbly present it to the World, now let His will be done! Please examine this Word, and search your hearts and inquire of God, may He lead you all in the right direction, and pull down from their high places all of those who harm His body and do not His will. God be glorified! Amen!”
And then it would be her constant prayer and praise that His will is being done concerning all of this!
There would not be all of this acting like a cat that got her dander up that appears to be showing her claws.
No, she would just say…”I will pray for you sister that the devil no longer blinds your eyes in any way that they may be being blinded. The Lords will is being done in this.”
I come here not to highjack the blog. I come here because I do not feel the presence of Christ here and I am concerned NOT FOR THE COPELANDS, The Lord has them well in hand, be they wrong or right, but for people that may be strong enough to come here, question things, and have this darkness that I feel is here come upon them.
The spirit of “stoneing”,
The esence of fault finding and being judgemental on others, and the air self-righteousness and the breeze of “I got things right and others mis-inturprate and got it all wrong. The mindset of well, they must me simpletons that just like haveing their ears tickled, but we are better then they and are above that now.
Simple child-like faith….The joy of learning of God….The love of His word….knowing He will loveingly show ya the way….because to Him you have made commitment and have recieved His dear son…. I refuse to stand by and let some stuffy, probobly joyless self appointed watch dog steal that from somebody out there who maybe needs to hear what I’ve got to say before they start thinking….O, I am just decieved and who realy knows who’s got it right and what the heck……I think I’ll just go have a few beers and forget about even trying.
Keep the joy of the Lord which is your strenth my friend!!!
Don’t let any one cinical, with whom maybe nobody can do right, talk you out of it!!!
As for me and you, we will keep seeking God, and reading His word, and praying in understanding and in the Spirit, and believing that He will show us if we are missing it. ….Copelands and Endtimes aside…We seek You Lord!
Amen.
“Dawn said: I know of a Jewish rabbi who accepted Jesus”
Dawn if its the rabbi im thinking of “i believe his name is Harold ” ive met him personally he did a sermon at my church here in Australia
Sorry this is “off topic” this is for Dawn:
http://martinrothonline.com/MRCC12.htm
His Full name is Rabbi Harold Vallins
Found this in a forum regarding the Copelands wealth..
…………………………………………………
Kenneth Copeland Gloria Copeland have dozens of shell corporations some mentioned in the letter by Senator Grassley. They blatantly violated IRS Federal IRS laws and regulations when they took land, assets and money donated to the ministry for their own possessions. This includes but is not limited to their “Copeland Cattle Company” , El Rancho Fe , their oil land and leases, the mineral land and leases, their Andalusian Horse ranch and company, Security Petroleum Inc. SCI, Pitcherman Inc., Victory Eagle Utility Service, and numerous other for profit corporations and companies that were formed with not for profit offering money of Kenneth Copeland Ministries and Eagle Mountain Church.
Copelands $12 million dollar house of over 18,000 sq feet sits on Eagle Mountain Lake and is near his multimillion dollar complex with his own airport and eight airplanes, racing boats and 23 vehicles.
According to Texas state vehicle records and private investigators Copeland has 21 different vehicles including seven 7 Harley Davidson motorcycles. They have a number of boats parked at the lake in their boat houses including a $200,000 racing cigarette style boat. He also has eight airplanes five of which are jet aircraft. He just bought his $20 million dollar Citation X his newest jet fuel guzzling one that costs $5,000 per hour to fly. He is working on buying Gloria her own Citation X(so they can meet up at the ski resorts, hunting lodges and island resorts they recently went to in their new Citation X.)
The whole so called ministry is a family run affair of nepotism cash raking. Over 10 years ago in 1996 the immediate family of Copelands children raked in $2.1 million dollars for one year in salaries. Ken and Gloria Copelands salary paid by the offerings to their organization was $659,170 not including outside offerings direct to them.
This was over a decade ago and does not include that their house, cars, airplanes, clothes and all expenses are also paid for by their organizations offering income.
Income that is meant for reaching souls (which they never do preaching only to Chrisians) not meant for weak people status symbol $12 million dollar houses, $150,000 cars, $200,000 boats and $20 million dollar airplanes.
Copeland also owns an Andalusian horse(El Rancho Fey “the ranch of faith”) on their complex which they breed and sell these horses a cost of $15,000 to start for the cheapest one. They also are being investigated for the oil wells that they bought with offering money yet in their own names and all of the income going to them personally.
Kenneth Copeland never gives anyone not even partners or staff a financial statement and this is what he says “We operate openly”.
The millions of people that need a meal, homeless, in need of clothing, and warm place to sleep, and the millions going into a dark Godless eternity while Copeland hoards millions of dollars and status symbols, spends these millions of dollars of offering money on his own lusts and these personal beyond luxury wasteful status symbols.
I am by no means a super Christian, nor do I want to pretend to be righteous, because I have a long way to go, and so forth. I do know this, I have looked at some end times prophecy, and I also feel that God is getting ready to clean house, and spit those of us who are lukewarm about him out of his mouth. I know you guys have some issues about Joyce Meyer, but one of the things she said was that the time was coming when people needed to be serious about God. I think that in the coming days, weeks, months, and years, God will be cleaning house. A lot of insincere, greedy, people who are pretending to hear from God and know him will be exposed. So if anybody reads this pray for me to get it together and be for God. Thanks
Just curious if Kenneth Will stand on his word about “not giving any informationto the government because it belongs to God not them” or be the whimp we all know he really is and buckle under to Senator Grassley… im thinking the latter actually… either way it isnt going to show the money he has “Stored” in overseas/offshore bank accounts….. strange really that one of the Copelands “meeting” destination is Switzerland…??? isnt it????
This is the last time I am entering this site because I feel…
A. I am not to be wise in my own eyes.
B. I am to depart from evil
C. I think it is in Jer 29, I could be wrong, where God says their “Prophecies” and the “dreams they cause THEMSELVES to dream” are not of Me saith God. (something like that)
Well, IF this site is NOT of GOD (same with the “prophecy”), then it is evil and I am to depart from it.
Either way……If it would be God’s word, or even if it is not, then I am not to be wise in my own eyes, and I should just shut the heck up.
I just DO NOT WANT ANYONE TO QUIT SEEKING THE FACE AND WORD OF GOD!!! I JUST DON’T WANT ANYONE COMMING HERE TO GET DISCOURAGED SAYING TO THEMSELVES EVERY “SECT” (for lack of a better term) CLAIMS THEY ARE THE ONE’S WHO ARE RIGHT AND THE OTHERS ARE IN SO MUCH ERROR!!!
I am fed-up with the (I got it soooooo right and the others don’t) type of garbage.
FIND THE LORD FOR YOURSELF. ENQUIRE OF HIM YOURSELF! DO NOT LET FLESH DETERMINE WHAT YOU BELIEVE FOR YOU! SEEK THE LORD AND HIS LEADING TO FIND YOUR WAY….WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION!!!
MY FINAL COMMENT ON ALL OF THIS!!!!
AMEN.
DAWNSURVIVOR!
I was just reading through the Copelands response to Senator Grassley (full version here.. http://www.kcm.org/financecommitteeresponse.php ) and wondered why Kenneth or whoever wrote it wrote this particular bit in..
To keep it pure on the Word of God
“To keep it pure sexually”
To keep it pure financially
what prompted him to add the bit about Keep it pure sexually??
Dawn im sorry you find people blogging the TRUTH offensive… perhaps once this has all come out in the open and you can see the truth you will see that we are NOT indeed EVIL but just the opposite… stay in the faith Dawn and please dont take offense or take what is typed here personally
peace be with you
It seems ediie long has relented at the last hour and says he will cooperate with Sen Grassley… But Creflo Dollar and his mentor Kenneth Copeland are still not cooperating..Mr Copeland seems to think he(and his legal team) can still withold the information from the Senator ,,Im thinking either one of two things will happen..Either Mr Copeland,his Wife and Son will Cooperate at the last second or he is going to try and fight it in court… either way it is just proving beyond reasonable doubt that Mr Copeland is hiding a lot of shady dealings that will eventually come out in the open.
Taking on the US government isnt the best plan Ken Copeland could have gone with..
If found guilty of Tax fraud he/his wife and son could possibly get a 5year maximum jail sentance
Comment from Apostle Prophet Alonda moved by admin -
I have been reading alot of this endtime sights and I have this to say about what you said about Kenneth and Gloria Copeland I believe you have one part correct Kenneth on numerous occasions has used the hand symbol for the freemason and he is in fact of high order most of the tv ministers use the freemasson/illuminate smybols I have studied and I have seen even Billy Gramham/Pat Roberson they have soled apart of themselves to this occult others know the full truth others come into it not knowing the whole truth yeat the ones who know take money from these devils this is why Yahuah is angery because they pollute the truth of the coming times by pretending it is not going to happen that Yahuah’s judements will not come in fact back in 2000 Kenneth Copeland made a false prophecy about George Bush being sent from Yah and that he is the man who will be used by Yahuah even this was in his monthly magizine funny even then yah has told me Bush wasn’t of him nor for him 5 yrs later it proved to be true I do like somethings about the Copelands do I believe they can repent YES it is our job to love them pray for them gently rebuke them.
Latest news is that all but Kenneth Copeland and Creflo Dollar have either submited Documents to Senator Grassley or said they will cooperate.
Copelands And Dollar are prepared to fight the investigation in the court rooms and are not backing down…
Senator Grassley is still trying to keep the dialogs open with Copeland and Dollar but if this goes on much longer Grassley will have no alternative but to Subpoena Copeland and Dollar to get the information he requires
Its a pity that Copeland and Dollar wont act like a REAL church,s and show transparency… but seeing as all the other “ministries” have complied it seems it isnt going to be favorable for Copeland and Dollar
wondered why Kenneth or whoever wrote it wrote this particular bit in..
To keep it pure on the Word of God
“To keep it pure sexually”
To keep it pure financially
what prompted him to add the bit about Keep it pure sexually??
This came from way out and caught me off guard, but I remmeber Jimmy Swaggart always talking about prostitutes,
seems to be their souls leaking maybe…..
and just another thot
have you ever wondered why GLoria always talks about her
kids John and Kelly and never NEVER mentions Terri as
a daughter… She must be Kenneths and someone elses.
go figure
Yep your right RJ Terri Copeland is not Glorias child
Kenneth Copeland and Creflo Dollar still holding out against Grassleys inquiry…and from what ive been reading of Grassleys response… Grassley is bending over backwards to accommodate Copeland and Dollar… maybe this is just going to be a complete political whitewash where absolutely nothing will be exposed… its certainly looking that way..Grassley seems to be Controlled from”within” by the powers that be and Copeland seems to be pulling strings and asking for Favors from people in high places…
Joh, there is a Higher Power than Grassley and Copeland
or Creflo. I believe the TRUTH will be exposed as God is
exposing and the Big Dogs (selfish) will fall. Im so sorry
for this as I used to believe there messages , Reason, I wanted what they were selling…I had a Massive Heart Attack in 06 and my wife tried to contact these people as
we were losing everything thinking we might get some help
Guess what…… we ended up on their mailing lists… asking me for donation….Jesse,Creflo,Savelle,Joyce,Kenneth,
There seems to be a common thread in all of the latter rain ministries, the Freemasons, thwe Mormons, the new age Lucius trust, the Joel’s army and the emergent church minitries. They all seem to espouse the exaltation of man.
Whatever happened to the simple devotion to the Suffering Servant, Jesus Christ. People have gone after the “annointing” rather than the Annointed one.
Even reconstructionists and dominionists’s think to highly of themselves.
Have Christian’s forgotten that victory came through the cross. And that Jesus said to His followers that we are to take up our cross, and lose our lives, and come and follow Him. James 5 says that we should be patient like the prophets of old. Ist Peter exhorts us to endure hardship, embrace the humiliation and suffering of christ.
I for one am commited to the Person of Jesus christ, my Lord and Savior. When He returns to establish his earthly kingdom I will be with Him. I have no interest in becoming God or a god. He is my Light and my life. I am satisfied with Him.
I pray that all the people that are being seduced by these apostate preachers will examine scripture as you continually suggest.
1st Peter 1 says that we are chosen according to the foreknowledge of god the Father according to the sanctifying work of the Spirit that we might obey Jesus and be sprinkled with his blood. Blessed are those whose names are written in the lambs book of life.
Thankyou for your faithfulness and courage. Tom
RJ,
It seems to be a one way street with the prosperity teachers. Funny they just have the means to help us.:)
OOPS that was they don’t have the means to help us.
Latest Update on the ongoing inquiry is that Kenneth Copeland through his legal team is saying he is quite happy to have an IRS inquiry in which Senator Grassley can obtain the information he requires…here is the link to the story.. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/5682737.html
… my immediate problem with this is that Copeland has had 6 months to rig his books to look squeaky clean for such an inquiry …also if he keeps on with his stonewalling of the grassley inquiry a subpoena is the next step and its looking more likely….
Joh
Thanks for all the updates
This is the last comment I’m making. I haven’t made a comment in a while because I’d said all I had to say. I’m also not going to argue with the people who defend the Copelands because they’re desperately hoping their ministry is true because of the money aspect.
People always look at the external, while God looks at the internal (the heart and its motives and intents). God has absolutely no problem with people being rich. The problem He has is idolizing money and being selfish, and coming to Him only because of the money they think He’s going to give them.
The Lord also has a big problem with people getting money by exploiting other people in any way. Jesus made that clear. Deception is one of the ways of exploitation.
Again, these people give certain scriptures, while pretending other scriptures that give the true picture don’t exist. The “ministry” is only for their family to be wealthy.
When partners (donors) need help, they find the Copelands won’t have a thing to do with them. I’m not talking about myself, but others who have told their stories. The Copelands give to ministries and people that get them publicity about their giving only. The people that need help and can’t get the Copelands publicity for giving are out of luck.
Yes, you can have what you say when you believe, IF it’s in God’s will. Other scriptures show that. You can’t believe with all your heart that you can flap your arms and fly no matter how much you believe and confess that. That’s ridiculous, and that’s what they have you believe.
No matter what you’re believing and confessing, it HAS to be in line with God’s will for your life, or it’s not coming, at least not from the Lord. They never tell you that.
I couldn’t care less if the Copelands have billions of dollars. That doesn’t affect me in the least. It’s stupid to be jealous of other peoples’ money and material things. I have a tremendous problem with the fact that they deceive and outright lie to achieve their purposes.
And for “Shelly,” who I have no doubt is checking this Website, though not commenting any more, I forgave these criminals at Eagle Mountain a long time ago.
I even asked the Lord to bless them while they were lying about and attacking me in church, and attacking me after I got thrown out of the church within five minutes for telling Steve, the usher, that MacManamy was an adulterer (which was true) after taking McManamy’s and others’ abuse for almost three years.
I have done that over and over, but only the Lord can change my feelings, and He hasn’t chosen to do that yet. My feelings are I absolutely despise these rotten people, and that hasn’t changed no matter how many times I forgive and ask the Lord to bless these criminals.
And I don’t feel the least bit guilty about that. I don’t have the ability to change my feelings, and the Lord will do that in accordance with His plan, whatever it is. I have told the truth, however, in every blog, including the three or four that weren’t posted.
In God’s timing, these peoples’ character and deeds will be completely exposed, and justice will be done.
The only other thing I have to say, again, is how can this possibly be happening to the Copelands? They always falsely teach if you are having any trouble, it’s your fault and you must be doing something wrong, or you don’t have enough faith. You’re losing at the faith game.
I hardly ever watch these crooks, but I’ve noticed this week that a lot of Copeland’s arrogance seems to be gone at this time. He’s still lying, of course, saying that the Senator is attacking him because Copeland’s Pentecostal and the Senator is not.
It was nothing to do with that, and everyone knows that. It has to do with the fact that these people are a corrupt, false ministry and all about getting others’ money.
If all of the people who have been following these people for years would get together and see the percentage of people who what the Copelands say came true, it would put a stop to this garbage. However, they’re brainwashed into thinking that would be going against God.
And even when people see through it and get out, there are always new people hearing this stuff and getting excited from the deception, so they always bring new people in to fund them.
In God’s timing, He will remove these heartless crooks. I just hope it’s pretty soon.