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Religion on Tap? Emerging Pub Churches

Article by Katie Liesener, from here - [bold emphasis is mine]

“A group of Boston University theology students were gathered at the Crossroads Irish Pub for their usual fish and chips last year when, caught up in theological discussion, someone suddenly asked: Why can’t church be more like this?

It was one of those wild propositions typically forgotten by morning. Except they followed through, designing a new kind of church to capture the authenticity they had felt. They welcome all to their services, but with a friendly word of advice: “Feel free to bring your own shot glass for communion.”

They’re not kidding.

This is the Pub Church: a weekly service held in a pub. Since April, the group has met every Saturday at 5 p.m. to celebrate the divine in a dive, welcoming Christians and non-Christians alike in a setting where notions of God flow as freely as the beer.

“With pubs in particular, people feel they can come as themselves. You don’t have to be or dress any particular way,” said Xochitl Alvizo, 35, one of the church’s founders. “We’re affirming the potential sacredness of any place.”

For last weekend’s service, that place was the back room of the Dugout, a college bar tucked below street level on Commonwealth Avenue. Amid dartboard and pool table, a harpist plucked a celestial flourish of arpeggios as the nine congregants bowed heads to sip their beers.

At the center of their seated circle, a low coffee table doubled as their altar “for the sharing of resources” – cheese pizzas, a pitcher of Sam Adams Octoberfest and a church-shaped donation box for charity and the tab. Their service bulletins, slipped into upright plastic holders, looked vaguely like drink specials.

Alvizo started the service by playing a Youtube clip of Barack Obama lauding the power of “one small voice.” Then, from a leather couch, she initiated the conversational sermon: “What do we think of the ‘one small voice?’ “

In the absence of rote ritual, anything could happen. In this case, a long, awkward silence.

Gradually, people ventured ideas.

“What I find to be most enriching in Christianity is the days you meet your opposite, that’s what makes your world larger,” said Marie Ramsdal-Thomsen, 27.

“Even a conversation can be a revolution,” responded Maggie Keelan, 24.

Just as their communal sermon gained momentum, funk music blasted over their voices from a speaker overhead.

For attendees of the Pub Church, these logistical challenges are still a welcome tradeoff for the psychological barriers many say they experienced in traditional congregations: coercive evangelism, hypocrisy, sexist liturgy, even rampant homophobia.

The key to avoiding those pitfalls, they believe, is leaving services open to personal expression and group revision.

“This feels more invested in people, more active, instead of sitting and watching a show, which is what church felt like,” said Jaclyn Jones, 30.

Bryan Stone, a professor at Boston University’s School of Theology, sees this impulse as reflective of the wider culture.

“Wikipedia is an example of this,” he said, referring to a consensus-based online encyclopedia. “Everyone contributes to the truth rather than relying on something handed down by an authority.”

Indeed, a handful of other pub churches have sprung up independently of each other in recent years, mostly in the United States and England. One of the earliest, Holy Joes in London, has met since 1989.

But whether Boston’s Pub Church can help spark a newly liberated era, like the American Revolution that simmered in the city’s taverns so long ago, is another question. Mark DeVine, an associate professor of divinity at Samford University in Alabama, identifies two strains of emerging churches, or congregations departing from institutional religion. One is evangelical, attracting outsiders to a particular faith; the other exists contentedly without dogma. He believes the latter, which includes the Pub Church, may fall victim to its own openness.

“To the extent that they refuse to define themselves, they may fade away,” DeVine said. “People don’t invest their time, treasure and talents in something that has no goal, no mission, that’s reducible to just a safe place to talk. It’s a wonderful idea, but not the basis for a church.”

Still, the Pub Church mirrors some aspects of traditional worship. It is applying for membership with the Disciples of Christ and adopt recognizable Christian rituals, such as communion. Also, though they hoped to rotate pubs every week, they have found themselves as cozy at the Dugout as an evangelical in a favorite pew.

Their service last Saturday concluded in relative sobriety (to be expected, after just 45 minutes) and spontaneous shouts of approval. Nearly everyone stayed afterward to drink and socialize.

For Alvizo, this sense of community is essential to the dogging question: What is a church?

“From a Christian perspective,” she said, “church is the people who respond to God’s good news.”

For the Pub Church, that’s good enough. The only remaining question: What’s on tap?”

November 17, 2008 - Posted by endtimespropheticwords | False Prophets and Teachers | , , | 17 Comments

17 Comments »

  1. My experience with church has been generally negative, in large part because the churches are not able to deal well with people who do not fall within certain well-defined categories. Basically, churches love nuclear family units. Those of us who are not in nuclear families are cast by the wayside, fifth wheels as it were. And God forbid if you’re female!

    In Greek, ecclesia (the word translated as church) is defined as “the people called out.” It doesn’t mean the big building, it doesn’t mean the fancy programs and laser light shows, etc., etc. The church is the people, but I think too many people, including Mark DeVine, don’t get it.

    Church, right now, is NOT a safe place to talk. You can’t expose your doubts and your fears. You have to conform to some ideal. For someone such as myself, for whom honesty is critical, the idea that I’m going to keep my mouth shut while the (for example) exclusively male God-talk is going on, is simply not going to happen. Eventually I’m going to explode (or, more likely, because I’m not rude) just walk out and never come back.

    I’m reminded that Jesus reached out to those who were considered outcasts in his world, the prostitutes, tax collectors and other notorious and despised sinners. Today, the church sits in its grand buildings with its great programs for families, while outside its lovely grounds are the despised. I’m thinking in particular of the megachurch around the corner from my house, the one that’s spending hundreds of millions of dollars on a new campus in another part of the valley.

    This outfit sent me a postcard advertising their sermon series about family a few months back. I thought about writing a letter to them and pointing out to them that according to them, I’m not a family, since I’m a single adult female living alone with my felines. (No, I am not a Crazy Cat Lady.) What would I get out of a sermon series talking about husbands, wives and children, when (a) I’m not married (b) I’m not likely to get married and (c) my biological clock has just about run out? But I decided not to do so, because I rather figured out that the postcard was more designed to drag in the neighbors in my heavily Mormon neighborhood and I was just collateral on the zip code mailing list.

    If people find something of meaning in this pub church, more power to them. I imagine you’d probably be more likely to find Jesus there than over at First Evangelical Megachurch of the Monster Campus.

    Comment by mirele | November 17, 2008

  2. Hi, ETP

    Interesting article. This would appear to be an outgrowth of the house church movement, though I had heard of people meeting at pizza restaurants, coffee shops, etc., but not at pubs. It does seem a bit odd–but whatever works. I would think that a quieter location might be more conducive to having a productive gathering of the ekklesia.

    While I’m excited about the house church movement and think it is a genuine move of God, I do agree with the cautions indicated by the phrases you chose to emphasize in bold. I believe (as you obviously do) that God still speaks directly to His people, however these words from Him need to be in line with scripture (or at least not in contradiction or addition to it).

    Many times, in my experience, I’ve seen simple church folk who don’t appear to be very familiar with scripture and who espouse some strange doctrines. They are not convincingly able to expound on these ideas and merely give the electronic equivalent of a knowing, mystical look when challenged. “You are clearly not among the enlightened ones if you need to have this doctrine defended”, they seem to say. A great need exists for these sincere people to learn God’s Word and how to rightly divide it.

    That said, I see nothing wrong with one of the functions of the church gathering as a “safe place to talk.” Surely, this is not all the ekklesia should be, but it is a thing sadly lacking in our traditional churches, most of which are a safe place to come, listen to a sermon, sing a few songs, and chat briefly with a few people on the way out the door. How wonderful it would be if the members of the church knew, helped, were involved in the lives of, and ministered to and with one another.

    I can identify with the attendees to the “pub church.” I wish the traditional church could be more like the pub on “Cheers.” This is a thing much more attractive to the lost–a place where everyone loves and accepts you, knows your name, and is interested and involved in your life.

    God bless,

    Cindy

    Comment by cindyinsd | November 17, 2008

  3. Hello,

    #1… Who says they are born of God and not of an anti-christ spirit?? They’re new-agey. That doesn’t = “Christian”, even if they think it does. There might me some weak Christians in there… but just because they call themselves Christian and want to have communion doesn’t mean they’re born-again. :)

    #2… Here’s a prophecy for you of upcoming events in the USA: http://sarahpalindeservesourvote.blogspot.com/2008/11/destiny-of-christian-usa-revelation-12.html

    It’s what I sense by the Spirit, I believe, to certain extent and things will be more clear as time progresses. (My primary focus is not “prophecy” though I was born-again in face to face salvation and am apostolic and prophetic just because… I am. My primary focus is on a Word ministry on salvation (soteriology).

    So, just felt like sharing because this is what’s coming. If you’re a “big fan” of the 666 Obama… sorry, can’t help turn him magically into a Christian for everyone who wants a black messiah… even some Christians.

    It’s gonna be a rude awakening… for some.

    Grace!

    Laura

    Grace!

    Comment by laura | November 17, 2008

  4. “It’s a wonderful idea, but not the basis for a church.”

    exactly. tho I’d love to visit once. :)

    Comment by kls | November 17, 2008

  5. wouldn’t Patricia King love this?

    Comment by Eve | November 17, 2008

  6. Sounds a bit like the sort of places that Jesus was found when He was reaching people. He did, however, still attend the synagogue (unless they threw Him out!) The danger is the Truth can get watered down or lost unless there is also time to meet in more traditional gatherings as well. As Boston is in New England, their ‘Pub culture’ may be more like the English pubs than the US bar culture, which I gather is rather different, being purely drinking etc rather than socialising. It will be interesting to see how this develops.

    Comment by Ian Hutchinson | November 17, 2008

  7. Miriam
    thank you for bringing this to everyone’s attention. While I believe Jesus said go to the hiways and biways, and compel them to come in, I don’t believe He meant to a loosely religious fuzzy Christian gathering in pubs. In the past, I and others I know, have gone into pubs with friends who weren’t Christians, to sit and talk about the gospel and what it means to each person’s eternal destiny. I noticed that while these conversations continued, the amount of alcohol consumed by the non Christians was very little. I saw the same thing happen at parties I was invited to after becoming a Christian , in order to see if they could draw me back into drugs, etc, only to have the Lord see to it, that not only did that not happen, but the others didn’t smoke their pot, etc, whilst t he sharing continued. Jesus invaded those parties. I don’t get the same sense of Jesus invading these pub gatherings.

    Comment by paul | November 17, 2008

  8. JN 8:32 “And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

    Check out the Washington Post story by David S. Fallis, Meg Smith and Madonna Lebling titled In Va., a Powerful and Polarizing Pastor dated November 15, 2008 that was emailed to all the news media
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/15/AR2008111502626_pf.html

    Scott’s followers see him as an inspiring interpreter of God’s word. Members pack the church most nights, united in their desire to live as the Bible intended and reject what they view as society’s moral ambivalence.

    “Church isn’t for everyone who wants to just show up,” Scott said in an interview. “It’s not a community club. We’re not looking to build moral, successful children. We’re looking to build Christians.”

    But for hundreds of members who have left the church during the past decade, Calvary is a place of spiritual warfare, where ministers urged them to divorce spouses and shun children who resisted the teachings. Scott is twisting the Bible’s message, they say, and members who challenged the theology were accused of hating God.

    Pastor Scott is a hypocrite who is no different than John Arnott Stephen Strader Peter Wagner or any other false Apostle in the Third Wave movement

    In 2002, three weeks after the death of his wife, Scott, who was then 55, stood before the congregation and announced that the Bible instructed him as a high priest to take a virgin bride from the faithful. A week later, he did — a pretty 20-year-old who a couple of years earlier had been a star basketball player on the church high school team.

    Scott said he has spent hundreds of thousands of dollars of church funds on a fleet of race cars and until last year devoted many weekends touring the circuit for his “racing ministry.” The church Web site shows Scott and his wife, Greer, 26, posing in racing suits, helmets in hand, beside a red dragster.

    Scott is Calvary’s “apostle” and presiding elder, and in 1996, he named himself the sole trustee, putting him in charge of virtually all of the church’s operations, its theology and finances.

    In his sermons, Scott teaches that his church is scripturally superior to others and views keeping people in the fold as a matter of their salvation. “Anything that’s other than a member in harmony has to be identified and expelled,” Scott preached in May 2007.

    Don’t be afraid of “social services” if you throw rebellious children out of the house, he told the congregation in an earlier sermon, because “you obeyed God.” In an interview, he cited scriptures: “Deuteronomy says if your kid doesn’t follow your God, kill ‘em. That’s what we do, but not physically. To us, you’re dead if you’re not serving our God,” he said.

    Comment by brad | November 17, 2008

  9. Cindyinsd:

    I have seen people gloriously saved after Christian witness in pubs so I do not really have a problem with any meeting place per se for the ‘church’ [although I question the wisdom of it as a regular place for gathering for various reasons].

    However the trend I am concerned about – [wherever the meeting place may be] is moving away from the authority of scripture to everyone seemingly having an equally valid opinion of their own, and like the article says the church becoming watered down and not being a church anymore and little more than a social group. But then again that exactly describes many ‘legitimate’ churches too!

    Comment by endtimespropheticwords | November 18, 2008

  10. Matthew 9:13
    But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

    I’m praying that Holy Spirit will woo those people in the pubs or(bars as we call them here.) Since alot of lost people aren’t coming into the “Building” called church. I agree with Cindyinsd. Besides we are to catch the fish not clean them!! That’s Gods job!!!

    Luke 14:23
    And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my HOUSE may be filled.

    Greek translation concordance #3624= οἶκός= HOUSE
    Of uncertain affinity; a dwelling (more or less extensive, literal or figurative); by implication, a ***FAMILY*** (more or less related, literally or figuratively) — home, house(-hold), temple.

    From what I see here it’s not so much the house/church building but the FAMILY that is important. Give them the Gospel and the Holy Spirit will quicken the Truth in their hearts. I agree that they shouldn’t stay where they are, eventually the Holy spirit will show them the truth and bring them out of the pubs. Afterall Jesus sat with the drunks and the prostitutes. One of them anointed His feet with oil and tears then wiped them with her hair!
    :o )

    Comment by born2praze | November 18, 2008

  11. Sounds kinda like the hippie meetings back in the 60’s-70’s. Young men and women gathering to talk about spirituality. Some genuinely (and/or desparately) seeking the truth, and some just trying to impress everyone with their philosophizing and spirituality.

    If you’ve ever heard Keith Green’s testimony, you’ll recognize an element of it in this article. Like, no Christians in that mix YET, but if even ONE becomes a true follower of Jesus – Look out! ;O)
    That group isn’t fallen away or anything – they’re just plain old nonbelievers talking/drinking.
    That they are gathering to discuss spiritual matters might mean that SOMEone in the group might not give up searching til he/she finds the REAL truth – Jesus.

    Comment by monkeyweather | November 18, 2008

  12. I don’t understand how anyone can object to this kind of church. The church is supposed to be everywhere and is certainly not limited to the Sunday morning service. If the church wasn’t greater than that well… This pub church is not offering an alternative to the Sunday service trying to fight it’s way into a market – for starters it is held on Saturday afternoons, so you will have the opportunity to join another congregation Sunday morning og afternoon. It is not claiming to be the whole truth or the full package.
    I enjoy the idea of challenging the established shape of the church. Jesus did go to the synagog but he also – and even to a larger extend – met the people where thet were and where they needed it the most. Some people are put off by the Sunday service, they find it to be too polished, too formel and so forth and shouldn’t also these people be able to hear the Gospel – even if it’s in a pub?? The Gospel is to be taught, heard and experienced everywhere – that’s the whole beauty of it. It is for everyone to share !
    So let’s be less restrictive and more open when it comes to finding ways to spread the Gospel – this is definately a case of “the more the merrier” !

    Comment by Marie | November 18, 2008

  13. These Christians do not seem to talk like disciples of Jesus-Christ. It is just another way to continue to do church, methinks. What is the point to go to a pub and drink beer and talk and talk and talk ? The unsaved people there will only think that Christians are like the rest of them after all…

    Comment by eric claire | November 18, 2008

  14. >> Besides we are to catch the fish not clean them!!

    Not so. How do you understand teaching, training, pastoring and discipleship then? Jesus did not just ‘catch fish’, he made disciples – and so goes the command to the disciples in the Great Commission, to make other disciples.

    Comment by endtimespropheticwords | November 18, 2008

  15. How many of us would birth our babies and then let them fend for themselves? They would starve, or fall in to wrong hands (like – the devil’s!!!). When we bring someone to the Lord, it is our responsibility to the best of our ability to disciple these people ourselves, or get them into a fellowship of people who follow the Word as it was written to the saints. And most of all, pray for them.

    Comment by marybee | November 18, 2008

  16. It doesn’t seem like the “congregation” at the pub church just talked and talked and talked. They prayed together, shared a meal together, shared the silence and shared a Christian togetherness that is for everybody – come as you are ! Pub church celebrates the fact that people can come together and love and care for one another – just like Jesus teaches us. And once again – I don’t think that pub church sees it self to be the whole truth or the full package – but most definately a supplement to the everyday worship and also a place for the people who would like to meet Jesus and other people in a different setting.

    Comment by Marie | November 18, 2008

  17. [...] # Now I know that some of the best beer in the world were first brewed by monks, but that’s no reason to turn any pub into a pseudo church! [...]

    Pingback by Good Reads {21 November, 2008} :: Word And Verse | November 21, 2008


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